Did Jefferson Sleep With His Slave?

Thomas Jackson, American Renaissance, December 7, 2012

ThomasJeffersonSlide
Verdict: Probably Not.

On November 30,  the New York Times published an op-ed piece by a law professor named Paul Finkelman, who calls Thomas Jefferson “a creepy, brutal hypocrite” because he owned slaves. Prof. Finkelman also takes it for granted that Jefferson had children with his slave Sally Hemings. Jared Taylor has written a response to Prof. Finkelman here.

What follows is a review of an unjustly neglected book that strongly defends the third President against the charge that he slept with his slave.

William G. Hyland, In Defense of Thomas Jefferson: The Sally Hemings Sex Scandal, Thomas Dunne Books, 2009, 292 pp., $26.95.

Nearly every American “knows” that Thomas Jefferson had several children with his slave, Sally Hemings. Nearly everyone “knows” that this has been confirmed by DNA evidence. Lefties even claim that Jefferson raped his slave. In fact, no one “knows” any of this; the evidence for a Hemings affair is unconvincing. If it were not for the ferocious joy the Left takes in believing the worst of the Founding Fathers, the allegations of an affair at Monticello would be a historical footnote.

William Hyland, a practicing lawyer and board member of the Thomas Jefferson Heritage Society, has written an important book that summarizes the evidence on both sides and argues convincingly that Jefferson was not the father of Sally’s children and probably never slept with her. His book is a welcome antidote to the mountains of nonsense that paint the third president as a lecherous old miscegenator.

The muckraker

It was a contemporary of Jefferson’s, a transplanted Scotsman named James Callender, who first spread the accusations about Sally. Callender was a journalist and propagandist who had written so insultingly about British politicians and even the crown that he abandoned his wife and child and escaped to the United States in 1793, one step ahead of the sedition police. He practiced the same vituperative brand of journalism in America, and was convicted in 1800 under the Sedition Act for attacks on President John Adams. Jefferson, who opposed the Federalist sedition laws, defended Callender, and pardoned him on becoming president in 1801. However, when Callender sought the position of postmaster general of Richmond, Virginia, Jefferson found him unfit for office and turned him down.

Callender turned on his benefactor, and in 1802 started writing about Jefferson’s sex life. He claimed Jefferson had sired a son with “dusky Sally,” a “wooly-headed concubine,” who was part of his “Congo harem.” Callender wrote that Sally was a “slut common as the pavement,” who was “romping with half a dozen black fellows,” and had serviced “fifteen or thirty gallants of all colours.” Federalist newspapers opposed to Jefferson’s policies circulated these stories with some effect, and Callender may have been right to claim that he had done more harm to Jefferson’s reputation in five months than all his other critics had done in ten years.

Callender never claimed to have met “dusky Sally” or any of her children, nor did he ever explain how he got his information. Naturally, many people thought he made it up. John Adams—whom Callender called a “hideous hermaphroditical character who has neither the force and firmness of a man, nor the gentleness and sensibility of a woman”—wrote of him: “I believe nothing Callender said. … I would not convict a dog of killing sheep upon the testimony of two such witnesses.” Abigail Adams called him “a libeler whom you could not but detest and despise.” James Madison distrusted him, writing that “it is impossible to reason concerning a man, whose imagination and passions have been so fermented.” In 1803, Callender drowned in two or three feet of water in the James River, reportedly too drunk to fish himself out.

Oral traditions

The only other source for the Jefferson paternity allegations is a sketchy set of claims made by Hemings’ descendants. In 1872, 37 years after Sally’s death and 46 years after Jefferson’s, one of Sally’s younger sons, Madison Hemings, gave an interview to a newspaper editor named S. F. Wetmore, in which he claimed that Jefferson was the father of all six of Sally’s known children. The interview, which is presented as a verbatim transcription, is in flowery language that seems entirely out of keeping with the vocabulary of an ex-slave, and closely follows the Callender version, even including the mistaken spelling of Jefferson’s father-in-law’s name that Callender used in his own account. Mr. Hyland notes that there is no other record of Madison ever having claimed to be descended from Jefferson. Wetmore had a political interest in besmirching Jefferson’s reputation and may well have sought Madison out and encouraged him to claim he had an illustrious father.

The other paternity claim was by Thomas Woodson, a somewhat mysterious black who claimed to be the son that resulted when Jefferson impregnated Sally when she was only 15 or so. This is a particularly improbable claim, since Jefferson kept detailed records of all births to his slaves, and there is no record of a child named Thomas or of a birth to Sally at about that time. Woodson’s claim has also been disproven by DNA evidence, but this has not stopped his descendants from claiming to this day that Jefferson was the father.

Was Monticello an interracial love nest?

DNA

In the late 1990s, DNA testing was carried out to see if the paternity of the Hemings children could be proven. The study was based on the fact that the Y chromosome, carried by all men, is passed intact along the male line, and is detectably different in different families. If Jefferson had fathered Sally’s children, the male-line descendents of her sons would have the Jefferson Y chromosome.

Male-line descendants of the dubious Thomas Woodson and of Sally’s last child, Eston Hemings, agreed to be tested. Interestingly, the descendants of Madison Hemings, the son who gave the Wetmore interview, refused to be tested. The results were announced with great fanfare in the November 5, 1998 issue of the British magazine Nature. First, as noted above, Thomas Woodson’s claim was bogus: There was no Jefferson Y in his male line.

It was the other finding that got all the attention: Eston Hemings carried the Jefferson Y chromosome. On the strength of this, Nature titled its article “Jefferson Fathered Slave’s Last Child,” but the editors knew this was deceptive. They knew that all male-line Jeffersons, including Thomas’s brothers and their sons, carried the Jefferson Y and were equally likely, from a genetic point of view, to be the father. It was only deep into the article—farther than journalists were likely to go—that Nature conceded this. Subtleties like this, of course, mean nothing to crazed lefties, who have cackled with joy ever since at the idea that Monticello was a miscegenist love-nest.

In fact, there were no fewer than 26 Jefferson men of reproductive age living in Virginia at the time of Eston’s conception, who could theoretically have been the father. As we will see, Thomas is not the most likely candidate.

There are a few other circumstantial arguments that can be made in favor of the love-nest claim. One is that Sally was reportedly light-skinned and attractive. She came to Jefferson as part of his wife’s property, and there were even rumors that his wife’s father was Sally’s father. If that were true, it would mean Sally was Jefferson’s wife’s half-sister.

Another argument is that Jefferson seldom freed slaves, yet he freed Madison and Eston Hemings in his will. Jefferson’s policy was to free slaves whom he thought could support themselves, and the Hemings men had learned trades. One would also note that Jefferson did not free Sally, either during his life or in his will.

Finally, it appears that Jefferson was at Monticello at the times when Sally’s children were conceived. However, Monticello was Jefferson’s home, and it stands to reason he was there often. Also, no one knows where Sally was most of the time, and there are notes that indicate she was sometimes living away from Monticello.

The Hollywood version of a 15-year-old Sally.

So much for the case for paternity. What are the opposing arguments?

First, despite the lefty derision they evoke, there are Jefferson’s views and character. He detested miscegenation, which he considered bad for both races. He also was greatly disturbed by slavery, and abhorred the sexual power masters held over female slaves. These well-publicized views add to the lefties’ glee: They can call Jefferson a hypocrite. However, he was probably the most self-controlled of all American presidents. His motto of conduct was, “When tempted to do anything in secret, ask yourself if you would do it in public; if you would not, be sure it is wrong.” To a remarkable extent, he lived by this standard.

The most lurid tale of fornication—and one Callender promoted—is that Jefferson took up with Sally while he was in Paris as Minister to France, and the 1995 movie Jefferson in Paris is full of amorous sport. This is deliberate provocation. Jefferson lost his wife Martha shortly before leaving for Paris, and was devastated by the loss. He promised on her deathbed that he would never remarry, and left for Paris by himself. Later he sent for his children, and someone in his household chose Sally—only 14 at the time—to be a maid for his nine-year-old daughter Mary. Along with Jefferson’s 15-year-old daughter Martha, the girls traveled to Paris and stopped on the way in London, where they met Abigail Adams. Mrs. Adams wrote that Sally was more child than adult and therefore not a good choice for a maid. Jefferson’s daughters, along with Sally, probably boarded at their school rather than under Jefferson’s roof. Wherever they were living, it is unlikely that Jefferson was carrying on an affair with a 14-year-old slave girl under the noses of his daughters. All the evidence suggests that he was not a very sexual man, and there is no real record that he ever took a lover after his wife’s death.

The charge that Jefferson fathered Eston—the son who did carry the Jefferson Y chromosome—is implausible for different reasons. Eston was born in 1808 and would have been conceived while Jefferson was in his second term. The Callender accusations had been circulating since 1802 and had been repeated with some damaging effect by Jefferson’s enemies. Is it likely that Jefferson would risk justifying those accusations while still in office?

Furthermore, Jefferson would have been 64 at the time of Eston’s conception, and his letters from that period are full of complaints about migraine headaches, arthritis, and intestinal infections. Jefferson lived another 19 years after that but his health was poor. Moreover, after retiring from the presidency in 1809, Jefferson moved back permanently to Monticello, where he would have access to Sally at any time, yet Eston was her last child. In the very unlikely case that Jefferson, as a sickly, often-absent, 64-year-old Chief Executive had fathered Eston, he would presumably have had more children with Sally after he retired. Mr. Hyland notes that Sally survived Jefferson by nine years, but there is no record of her ever claiming that the president was her lover.

As for Madison Hemings, whose descendants refused DNA testing, his conception would have occurred in April 1805. Again, Jefferson was still president and therefore unlikely to do anything to justify accusations of miscegenation. He was present at Monticello for several weeks that month during the final illness and funeral of his daughter Mary. He was grief-stricken by her death, and the house was full of guests and mourners. Would Jefferson have been sporting with a slave concubine at such a time?

As she grew older, Jefferson’s eldest daughter Martha became the de facto mistress of Monticello. Her father always liked to have her and her seven children close, and she would have been at Monticello when Sally’s later children were conceived. She was familiar with everything that happened on the plantation and always vehemently denied the remotest possibility of any kind of impropriety between her father and any slave woman.

Martha, Jefferson’s daughter, was in a position to know.

Jefferson himself never explicitly denied the Sally rumors, but during his career he faced many accusations, and adopted the policy of not dignifying them with replies. Late in life, however, he did write that of all the many scurrilous things said about him only one was true: that when he was a young bachelor he had made improper advances to the wife of an acquaintance, John Walker. This is an implicit denial of the Sally affair.

Finally, there is the account of a contemporary eye-witness, Jefferson’s plantation overseer, Edmund Bacon. Bacon probably knew better than anyone what went on at Monticello. In an account of his years as Jefferson’s overseer he briefly mentioned the paternity allegations but denied them. He wrote that instead of Jefferson he saw — and here the name is rubbed out of the original manuscript — someone else leaving Sally’s quarters “many a morning” when Bacon “went up to Monticello very early.” His account is difficult to dismiss.

The likely suspect

Who, then, fathered Eston? Like many careful scholars, Mr. Hyland has a prime suspect: the president’s younger brother, Randolph.

Randolph lived only 20 miles away, was often at Monticello, and was probably there at the right time. There still exists a letter from the president inviting Randolph for a visit that would have taken place exactly nine months before Eston was born. At that time he would have been a 51-year-old widower, a far more likely father than the older and ailing president.

Years later, a former Jefferson slave, Isaac, wrote an account of life in the slave quarters. Of Randolph, he wrote, “Old Master’s brother, Mass Randall, was a mighty simple man: used to come out among black people, play the fiddle and dance half the night”—circumstances that could easily lead to dalliance. Isaac’s account says nothing about Thomas taking an interest in slave women, and he was never known to spend his leisure time with slaves.

It is worth noting that at the time of Eston’s conception Randolph had four sons, ages 18 to 26, who would also have carried the Jefferson Y. There is no record of their presence at Monticello at that time, but given the fraternizing habits of their father, it seems unlikely that they always held themselves aloof from slaves either.

Randolph remarried after Eston’s birth and had several sons, so it is clear that he was potent. His new wife is said to have been a domineering woman who did not often let him go back to Monticello. Perhaps she did not want him near Sally.

Finally, the Eston family tradition was that he was descended from a Jefferson “uncle.” Eston would have been of Jefferson’s children’s generation, all of whom referred to Randolph as “Uncle.” This tradition fits the view that the younger brother rather than Thomas was the father.

There are suspected fathers of the other Hemings children. One of Jefferson’s sisters married a man who died at age 30, leaving two sons, Sam and Peter Carr. Jefferson was very fond of the Carr brothers and treated them like his own children. Peter later admitted that both he and Sam had slept with Sally, adding that “the old gentleman had to bear the blame” for their misbehavior. Jefferson’s oldest grandson, Thomas Jefferson Randolph, believed that Jefferson was so indulgent towards the Carr brothers that he would never have suspected them of fornication.

There are a few other arguments and counterarguments to be made on the paternity question, and Mr. Hyland summarizes them well. It should be clear, however, that the case against Jefferson is hardly air-tight, and one would think that the Thomas Jefferson Memorial Foundation, which runs Monticello, would defend the president. Not so. The foundation drew up a committee to look into the allegations and appointed a woman named Dianne Swann-Wright to head it. She is black, and a specialist in slave oral traditions. Not surprisingly, she chose to believe the slave accounts. As one white committee member later complained, Miss Swann-Wright and at least one other member clearly reached their conclusions before they examined the evidence. Guides at Monticello are instructed to say that Jefferson was the father, and the foundation web site says all six of Sally’s known children “are now believed to have been Thomas Jefferson’s.”

Mr. Hyland notes that aside from the fashion for mocking dead white men, the foundation may have another reason for kicking Jefferson’s corpse: money. Promoting Monticello as a secret sex nest is good for business. In the years before the controversy, Monticello was getting about $2 million in contributions every year. After the DNA test, contributions jumped to more than $10 million a year — a sad commentary on how Americans approach their own history.

Journalists and academics took reckless joy in writing Jefferson off as a miscegenating hypocrite. There could be no greater contrast to the exquisite sensitivity with which they protect Martin Luther King, Jr. American newspapers would not mention his record of flagrant plagiarism until the British broke the story, and they have largely kept mum on King’s well-documented philanderings and Communist associations (see “The Unknown Martin Luther King, Jr,” AR, Jan. 2009). Some day, whites will be able to look at the past without seeing it through a haze of guilt. Mr. Hyland’s book is an important step in that direction.

 

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Thomas Jackson
Thomas Jackson lives in Virginia and has been writing for American Renaissance for more than 15 years.
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  • Anan7

    Why is it relevant that Jefferson miscegenated? Other than that the left and cultural Marxists relish potential hypocrisy of one of our Founding Fathers?

    We should debate the issues and not the potential shortcomings of a deeply personal nature.

    • DudeWheresMyCountry?

      The reason is that the left and their enabled Black minions want to take slavery further; slave owners were not only owners of humans but also were rapists with a deep rooted attraction to the African womb. Lies.

      • pcmustgo

        Some were rapists. Probably more so in Brazil where there were no white women around… and the rest of Latin America too.

        What’s it got to do with today?

        What does Thomas Jefferson have to do with me? Why am I blamed and brow-beated….?

        • DudeWheresMyCountry?

          Why because you are White and Amerika today is all about racial hatred of White Americans… past and present.

      • Nubian Times

        “slave owners were not only owners of humans but also were rapists with a deep rooted attraction to the African womb.”

        Can anyone deny this?

        • Grim Jim

          I do. I would like to point in the direction of the culprits you seek, the jews. Read “Who Brought The

          Slaves To America?” by
          Walter White Jr

        • DudeWheresMyCountry?

          Yes, anyone with a median IQ over 75 might. White male attraction to Black women is extremely low. Any of the celebrity Black women that are ogled over by society are mixed with light features such as Halle Berry, very rarely are true full-blooded Blacks considered attractive. I will tell you this and nobody mentions it; Black women love White men. They do and they aren’t shy about it.

          I’ve read a few of your posts and frankly you are out of your league here. You should consider posting at a lower IQ forum where objective, critical thought isn’t required by the readership. Here you won’t be able to resist resorting to emotional, bigoted responses when your points and arguments fall flat.

          • Franklin Ryckaert

            He should publish in the Nubian Times. Average IQ of readership :70, tenor of publications : Afro-Centrism.

          • Nubian Times

            Wow! Was Darwin right? He stated that inbred mutant albinos were recessive inadequate hybrid homo sapiens not fully human like Africans. Wait,…no…that’s not right. Darwin actually wasn’t that smart to realize that fact.

            I love this web site. So called white men complaining on their inevitable extinction .

          • Franklin Ryckaert

            Obviously you don’t understand the difference between Whites and albinos. Whites are a normal phenomenon, albinos aren’t. There are albinos among all races, including Whites. If Whites are “not fully human like Africans” then how come they have developed a far higher civilization than the Africans? Does “Afro-centric science” have an explanation for that? Or have the “inbred mutant albinos” perhaps stolen the intelligence from the superior Africans?

          • Nubian Times

            Biology states that Albinos, so called white people are a specific inbred mutant albino that came directly from the area know today as India.

          • DudeWheresMyCountry?

            You silly negroes! Name one thing Blacks, outside of running and jumping do better than any other race. Name one thing. I dare you. Crime doesn’t count either. If you could just be honest with yourself you could accept your inherent inferiority in virtually any category there is. During the Renaissance your ancestors were living in mud huts running from Lions, mine were building violins and painting the Sistine Chapel.

            If you only knew most non Blacks just want to be away from Black people forever… yet the last thing you want is to be left alone. Pathetic and shameless you are as a people.

          • Nubian Times
          • DudeWheresMyCountry?

            First off, many of the so called civilizations you cite were not Sub-Saharan Bantus. Your ancestors couldn’t even write, or navigate or come up with even the wheel. Bantus had to wait for The Portugese to arrive so the White men who navigated thousands of miles on ships could discover and name the islands along the West African coast. You come from people of the mud and they never even achieved the Bronze Age.

            Even if your list was totally Bantu and The Islamic Caliphs of Africa were Black ruled nobody would be impressed anyway.

            The accomplishments of Bantu Africans is an oxymoron. Your contributions don’t exist.

          • Nubian Times

            EXTINCTION IS THE INBRED MUTANT ALBINOS HYBRID SPECIES DESTINY.

          • Luca

            Not so fast. They discovered that bathing in cow urine acts as an insect repellent. And it only took them 5,000 years to come up with that one.

          • Nubian Times

            When you can not deal with the truth, name call. Extinction is so called white peoples destiny and guess what, the world will continue to spin with the descendants of Africans leading.

          • DudeWheresMyCountry?

            Africans will never lead, not even in Africa. Unlike you, we don’t want to commit genocide upon Black people, we just don’t want to have a society and culture with you. We don’t want your failures and crime and and animosity to be our burden, our concern. We don’t want our children around your children. We don’t want to tie our destiny with yours. We just want separation, but your kind doesn’t because you can’t do anything on your own.

          • Nubian Times

            Biology states that
            Albinos, so called white people are a specific inbred mutant albino that came
            directly from the area know today as India.

            Emphasis on Inbred mutant albino. A specific change on
            a sequence of Nitrogen bases occurred altering the amino acid sequence,
            changing them into enzymes. The European group does not have the ability to
            produce melanin (The Nitrogen bases order changed for the worse, thus the amino
            acids changed into enzymes…..But there is more…..Those enzymes mutations
            cause COLORLESSNESS). Look it up. It’s not hidden information but many Inbred
            mutant albinos Interpret or distort the information. Colorlessness has no
            biological advantage. LOL at inbred mutant albinos delusion. They are a
            creation of genetic splicing and amino acid polymer failures.

          • plato102

            What is Nubian’s IQ?

          • Nubian Times

            Can you even write an independent clause?

          • DudeWheresMyCountry?

            You silly negroid. All people laugh at you. The world collectively doesn’t agree on much but they certainly do on one issue: African Blacks are usually a waste of space and are a blight wherever they wind up, be in Haiti, Detroit or Johannesburg. Ask an Indian, a Chinese, a European, an Arab, a Mexican, anybody… they all look down on you… and for good reason.

            Please Nubian, tell us of one, just one Black person who has accomplished anything that gives them a place amongst the great minds of mankind. Name one. You won’t! It doesn’t exist. Now, git boy!

        • bryan smith

          Yes, a retarded half black could, or so could statistics on rape in America,

      • Joseph U

        It is established fact among blacks that whites envy them because of their fertility and our “mutant” melanin deficiency.

        • DudeWheresMyCountry?

          Is that part of the Black oral tradition? Delusional and laughable. Don’t kid yourself, nobody envies Black people for anything.

    • pcmustgo

      Many white men sleep with black prostitutes (although they do command a lower wage than white ones) and it’s considered sort of a “naughty” taboo thing to do.

      • Gary

        This is true.

      • DudeWheresMyCountry?

        Men who seek prostitutes have issues. If ya gotta pay to play just call it a day. Bottom line is 90% of Blacks want to breed with Whites… 90% of Whites would rather be sterilized than breed with Blacks.

        • Franklin Ryckaert

          Yes, that’s why you have so few cases of White-on-Black rapes. The opposite is almost epidemic.

        • plato102

          Please cite a source for your statistics.

          • DudeWheresMyCountry?

            What statistics? I’m stating the obvious.

        • Nubian Times

          You have to be kidding. White women are being pimped religiously. And unlike Thomas Jefferson Black men / Africans are choosing not to have children with them. You guys are not in touch with reality. I think many of you thought Romney would win by a landslide.

          • DudeWheresMyCountry?

            It’s your pipe dream. Very few White women like Black men, most find them ugly, primitive, unintelligent and unreliable. It’s your fantasy but unlike you we don’t dream of your women, nobody does. Black women are the bottom of the totem pole.

          • Nubian Times

            LOL. You need to get out more because you are either lying to yourself or you have not left your mothers basement-

          • DudeWheresMyCountry?

            Yes Nubian, keep telling yourself anyone thinks much of the beauty of a dark skinned Nubian Bantu woman with African features. You don’t even deep down, you think they are gross… and it fuels your obsession with White women. For every White man that wanted a Black woman, a million Black men fantasized about White women.

          • Nubian Times

            I wish to replicate myself. That can only be done with the intelligent, original, inverted lips, beautiful hips African / Black woman.

            Keep on believing your own lies. Most Black, 99% of them are married and have children with Black women.

          • DudeWheresMyCountry?

            Your right, no way anything but another African could replicate you. It’s too bad you won’t go do that in Africa. 99% of Black men are married? Say that to anyone, Black or White and wait for the laugh.

          • Jason

            I agree with Nubian Times. Some of you are suffering from a form of cognitive dissonance when it comes to this issue.

          • DudeWheresMyCountry?

            Her ancestors refused DNA tests, sounds like cognitive dissonance is present on this issue alright.

          • clip11

            You do know that besides wm/aw, bm/wf couples are the most common interracial couples? When im out in public and see someone pushing a mixed race baby, it’s usually a white woman and they all aren’t 300 lbs like you white men would like to believe. I’ve seen very attractive white females go for black guys.

    • adplatt126

      Couldn’t agree more.

    • Joseph U

      If so, then it is what it is and I’d accept the truth of it. Look at the T.J. quote that AmRen has right on the top bar.

      BUT- this is the typical nose under the the tent with these white-culture assassins. We will take the slimmest of evidence -wrap it in thick layers of hearsay and speculation and present it as a fact with which we can impugn the entirety of white civilization or elevate someone in a mud-hut. It is not even a preponderance of evidence which would be sufficient in a civil suit, let alone beyond reasonable doubt or minimal .95 confidence level for scientific publications but never mind, it is now established immutable fact.

      There is tremendous remaining evidence, for example of the fraudulence and infidelity of M.L. King but you can be damned sure that they don’t have an “expert in white oral tradition” presenting these stories to the public because that would cast aspersions on the apotheosis of the Civil Rights Movement. Again, another example of using different standards when comparing races which should be challenged.

      There simply is no defense for being white.

  • DudeWheresMyCountry?

    So Monticello tour guides must lie and say Jefferson had relations with a teenage slave girl while in his sixties because Dianne Swann-Wright says so? Just another example of putting Blacks in any position of power results in hateful lies directed at White Americans, living and dead.

    • You Are Now Enriched

      Challenging their claims will facts is a racist construct and will be punished.

  • William Allingham

    Even if it were true that Jefferson went to bed with a black woman, it should be pointed out as something that we ought not to do, and see its bad consequences, even today (it doesn’t justifies Liberalism, totally the contrary).

    If Jefferson was an hypocrite (something i dont know) then we should make sure now to get leaders that are not. That means someone that is not Obama (the biggest hypocrite).

    I dont see how the left could benefit from this affair if we had a strong sense of right and wrong.

    • DudeWheresMyCountry?

      America’s heroes have become it’s targets. How far we have fallen… but the upside here is every time they try to diminish our heroes a few more White Americans wake up to the nonsense.

    • pcmustgo

      SHE WAS A QUADROON- SHE PROBABLY LOOKED MORE LIKE THE LATINAS BARDON’S INTO….

    • Dean

      I am more inclined to belive that Jefferson did have sex with Sally Hemmings. That being said , my response is so what?! Give it a rest people!

  • E_Pluribus_Pluribus

    “Verdict: Probably Not.”
    ===

    Cumulatively, the abundant evidence presented here from William G. Hyland’s book makes that case. For example, there is Thomas Jefferson’s much younger brother Randolph (51 years old vs 64 for Jefferson), who frequented Monticello and was known for his affinity for the company of the slaves,

    “Old Master’s brother, Mass Randall, was a mighty simple man: used to come out among black people, play the fiddle and dance half the night” (Isaac, a former Jefferson slave).

    Randolph also had four sons age 18 – 26 who carried the Jefferson Y-chromosome. But tagging any of these — or the 20 some others in Virginia with the Jefferson Y-chromosome with miscegenation with a slave — is so much less satisfying than declaring definitively that an old and ailing Thomas Jefferson the father of Sally Hemings’ children.

    “Journalists and academics took reckless joy in writing Jefferson off as a miscegenating hypocrite.”

    Verdict first; evidence last — if ever.

    • pcmustgo

      There probably was a lot of this going on. Or some. I knew a black girl who’s tri-racial ancestry included a master who married his slave. Don’t forget most slaves were owned by people who owned just a few of them, and were very close with the family. This was normal back then. This was life.

      • MikeofAges

        These leftists should make a greater effort to understand the words of some their own anthems. Didn’t Bob Dylan have that line. “It’s life and life only.” English translation: Quit whining about everything already.

  • William Allingham

    Even IF it were true that Jefferson went to bed with a black woman, it should be pointed out as something that we ought not to do, and see its bad consequences, even today (it doesn’t justifies Liberalism, totally the contrary).

    Anyway a man of 64 having a child with a 15 years old woman is very improvable and could be expected only of a man like Hugh Hefner openly promiscuous (even then would be difficult) not from a romantic conservative like Jefferson but liberal minds dwell mostly in the realm of fantasy and facts are never obstacles to their dogma.

    If Jefferson was an hypocrite (something I don’t believe) that would be resolved with better morals and not with liberality, making sure to get leaders that are not hypocrites like Obama (the biggest hypocrite).

    I don’t see how the left could benefit from this “yellow press” if we had a strong sense of right and wrong.

    • Franklin McPherson

      A lot of you so-called race realist white guys are hypocritical when it comes to miscegenation. You’ll be up in arms about a pretty, playboy bunny type white girl having sexual relations with a black or other non white man, especially if she gets pregnant and has a baby by him, but if a white man has sexual relations with a pretty black (or nonwhite woman) it’s, while not necessarily condoned, at least not publically, winked at and given a “boys will be boys attitude”.

      You can’t have it both ways, you can’t just be against miscegenation when its a pretty white woman with a black man or a mexican man or a middle eastern man, but be lukewarm about it when its a white man with a pretty black woman or nonwhite woman. Not if you want to be taken seriously.

      You’ll notice, especially during school desegregation in the south, that the principle reason for white men opposing it was black boys being next to white girls. There seemed to be no concern of white boys having access to black girls.

      • William Allingham

        this is the kind of comment one would expect of someone unfamiliar with the object of his critique. doesn’t surprises me that in psychological experiments conservatives seem to understand liberals view even when they dont agree but liberals just adjudicate evilness or hypocrisy to conservatives without understanding their real motives. I have been around this forum for a while now and i have never seen someone that agrees to any kind of miscegenation, we are equally displeased by it regardless if is done by a white man or woman.

        why is it relevant if there are some hypocrites about what they say? (i dont know who have you met) as i said that gets fixed with better morals its not like “oh they did something wrong then lest institutionalize that bad behavior”. Even the wildest of animals when domesticated have attempted to copulate, even with members of another species and there relies our concern; that humans are the most domesticated species in the planet and that can lead our most naive youngs to do very pernicious things.

        if you are a white man im glad you are reading these comments and that you are around this page because even if now you are in some kind of campaign against us the information in here will help you to open your eyes to reality and hopefully you will stand up for your yourself and do something fro your childrens future (not succumb with guilty fear to the demands of careless, ungrateful aliens).

        • Doppleganger

          “…we are equally displeased by it regardless if is done by a white man or woman.”

          That is 100% False. More criticism is directed at white women for race-mixing than white men.

          • clip11

            Particularly if the white woman in question is attractive.

          • Tom Boyce

            Perhaps this holds true among your circle of friends. However, I hardly think you are a representative example. Your bias appears to be showing.

          • Charles Edward Lincoln III

            When I see a white boy or man with a black girl I cannot help but wonder how much he hates his father and grandfather that he would so dishonor them (or their memory). It is much rarer, on the whole, to see white males with black females.

            I think the MEDIA exalts White women being with Black men—so basically, there’s a lot more social pressure and social sanction in favor of white women going with black men—so there’s more to talk about in terms of fighting it. There is no particular panache for a white man to go out with even the sexiest jungle bunnies….it’s a lack of character, pride, and self-esteem when we dishonor our families this way though, male or female.

            Traditionally, and in fact throughout the annals of evolutionary biology, the male selects the female for her beauty (her ability to stimulate and inspire him) and her reproductive potential while the female selects the male for his strength and productive potential. Interracial marriages are not famous for success on either front, but they have been sufficiently successful that groups of persons of mixed race are now discernible, and we should try to encourage that “like pursue like”…..including people of mixed heritage. This will ultimately lead to more phenotypic and genotypic diversity, which I for one totally favor.

            The Spanish Colonial Castes (preserved in Louisiana in the categories “Mulatto”, “Quadroon”, and Octaroon) and the South African system of categorizations of “Coloreds” properly sought to preserve the diversity of groups of equal admixture.

            On the other hand, I don’t think that there’s any Spanish Colonial Caste category that quite captures the mess that will be the offspring of Kim Kardashian and Kanye West.

          • Carlos Geary

            Charles:
            You should take a course in genetics. Genes do not mix, do not dilute or change. A mixed race person inherits black & white genes and most of the time “looks black” because dark genes are dominant and light genes are recessive. Also, recessive genes re-appears in next generations. The expressed gene is said to be dominant over the unexpressed gene, which is described as recessive. If a person of mixed black/white ancestry mate with a white, the number of white genes increase, each generation until black genes dissappear.
            Some “black” parents both of mixed race , are capable of producing white children, but their white children (because they inherit only recessive genes) will not have the ability to produce black children, (because dark genes are not recessive) unless they mate with someone else who is black. If the white descendants only mate with other whites then the entire line and population will only be white even though the original ancestor was black.

  • pcmustgo

    Sally Hemmings was only 1/4th black anyways! She was a quadroon. Probably looked like a Puerto Rican. I’ve seen some of the pictures of the mixed race slaves people, sadly, owned back then and some of them got so inter-bred with white they looked purely white…

    • Jerrybear

      30% of American blacks have European blood. I believe that is what accounts for their 15 – 20 point IQ rise from their Sub-Saharan kin.

      • D.H. Andrews

        Right on the money. One correction, perhaps. I think the stats are that on average, American negroes are 30+% White. Correct me if I’m wrong.

      • Nubian Times

        Wrong. You are interpreting DNA incorrectly since all humans beings are derived from the African man and woman / Black people of Eastern Africa- Also, state your sources? Stop repeating something that is not true.

        • Grim Jim

          Nonsense

        • Gracchus123

          Pure speculation on your part.

        • Franklin Ryckaert

          What else than “Afro-centric” drivel can we expect from someone who calls himself “Nubian Times”? Even if (a big IF) we all descend from Eastern Africans, then in the course of racial evolution we have CHANGED. It is those changes that made us into different races and that shows in the DNA.

          • Le Gaulois

            Blacks never conceived, nor will they ever understand anything about evolution.

            Every time they argue that Whites descend from them, blacks simply confirm that they are the primitive backward version of Whites.

            According to their logic, we should all also bow down to the still living great apes just as well. It’s pathetic really…

      • You Are Now Enriched

        NO!

        0% of American blacks have European blood.

        Race mixing kills the White blood and creates mongrel blood, which is 100% Diversity Only.

        “Half-White” is a hate lie. No such thing…

        • Jerrybear

          I’m not advocating it. I’m just stating a fact. American blacks have on average 30% European blood. In my opinion, this accounts for why they are smarter the Africans. Those genes aren’t suddenly purged when someone mates with a Bantu. They are still there. That’s why occasionally you get intelligent blacks.

          • ATBOTL

            There is a lot of evidence that black groups in Africa have a pecking order within each country that correlates with how much Eurasian/proto-Eurasian ancestry they have versus the OLD African groups. Caucasoid inflected Tutsis rule the Bantu Hutus, Bantu people like the Kikuyu(who’s male line of ancestry derives from the same group that left Africa) rule the Luo who are less closely related to Eurasians. Arabized blacks in Sudan long ruled the indigenous Dinka tribes. Bantu people displaced Bushmen in Southern Africa.

          • pcmustgo

            Ibo (ebw?) do very well in Nigeria and have naturally lighter skin.

        • pcmustgo

          No, calling a mixed race person Black is disrespectful to the white side of the family.

          And by your logic, is “white racist” James Watson, who discovered DNA, “Black”?

          • You Are Now Enriched

            No, there is no such thing as the White side of the family. White genes go extinct when mixed with Diversity genes.

            No such thing a 1/2 White. The is White, and then light skinned black, which is 100% mongrel, 0% White.

          • pcmustgo

            Ok, then James Watson, the guy that discovered the DNA chromsome is black now. Thanks for giving the Afro-centrists another one to add to their black inventions list.

            1/16 or less black sure does look damn white!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I’ve met blonds with blue eyes and no traces of blackness or mixedness who have 1/16 or so black in them.

          • Carlos Geary

            Your statement is not scientific. Some other people, believe that If whites and blacks have kids they’re destroying the white race, because, they ignore basic genetic rules. If a black person, mates with a white person, their children would just look black, but if those mixed children mate with another white, they would look white.

            The genes for the white race are still there, but their opportunity to be expressed in the children in the first generation are decreased, because black genes are dominant, but only at first generation. White genes will reappear, next generation because white genes are recessive.

            Some black parents, are capable of producing white children, but their white children (because they inherit only recessive genes) will not have the ability to produce black children, unless they mate with someone else who is black hair. If the white descendants only mate with other whites then the entire line and population will only be white even though the original ancestor was black.

            !

      • ATBOTL

        More like 95% have European blood and as whole they average about 20% white.

        There is also the fact that most blacks in Africa were already mixed with Caucasians who migrated to Africa(in stages, so by the time they got to the Congo for ex. they were mixed and had acquired genes for tropical disease resistance) and presumably spread agriculture and animal husbandry before written history. Recent DNA analysis has revealed this. About 5% of Bantu men have direct descent on the paternal line from the same men as most Western Europeans(and many Egyptians). Most likely, neolithic Caucasians migrated down the Nile valley to cross the Sahara and spread out across the Sahel spreading genes and technology to the ancestors of the Bantu people and other Africans.

        • pcmustgo

          There were certainly Jews who wandered down there after the Roman invasion of Israel, and that’s why there is the Lemba tribe in Nigeria, dna proven descendents of Jews

      • scottthestrategerist

        What about Clarence Thomas? Look, I’m not liberal, but the man is the greatest Supreme Court justice since the demise of the Republic. He’s also DARK. I know the average black IQ is 85. I know they are much more likely to be involved in crime than whites. But what about him? Is he just one in a million (or billion)?

        • Jerrybear

          There are always exceptions. Just because Clarence Thomas is dark doesn’t mean he has no European blood. Just like there are some really dumb white people, there are intelligent blacks. Most of them tend to be conservative. I was talking averages.

    • Nubian Times

      I guess not being a pure recessive “white person” is okay, just as long as you do not have the dominant Black genes. A little melanin (if that was even the case) is okay? Wow. white peoples mental problems are clearly seen on this site, enlightening.

  • pcmustgo

    “Old Master’s brother, Mass Randall, was a mighty simple man: used to come out among black people, play the fiddle and dance half the night”

    Simple Whites may do better with Blacks!

  • adplatt126

    6 children. 6. That’s a lot for an infrequent visitor to Monticello. Other circumstantial facts support the view that Jefferson was the father. Didn’t his daughter free all of this woman’s children? They’ll never be a definitive answer to this question, but my feeling is, if Sally Hemings looked anything like that picture, everyone on this website is kidding themselves if they think he wouldn’t have taken a piece of that, racist or not. Men are hypocrites when it comes to sex, the third POTUS certainly included in that category. I think this article is at best optimism and at worst outright denialism. In Jefferson’s case, people took the cover-up at face value and didn’t bother to really look into it, believing what they wanted to believe and acquiescing to power. But in this case, the left and the sensationalists were probably right, even if their reasons before the DNA study came out were insufficient and driven by ideology. A Jefferson was the progenitor of the Hemings’ line… the relationship between TJ and SH was fairly intimate according to all records. It’s more likely that the daughter was protecting her father’s legacy. So Thomas Jefferson had some kids who had about as much black in them as James Watson. So?

    • DudeWheresMyCountry?

      So what you are assuming is that one of the smartest Americans ever was too dumb to realize having six mulatto bastard children would be even remotely intelligent? That is a big leap. Political moguls like Jefferson always have and always will have enemies and it seems unlikely a US President could father so many illegitimate children without somebody revealing this truth back then with more than conjecture.

      • adplatt126

        The bigger leap is to think that because someone thinks something is wrong, this means that they won’t do it. Brilliant people do dumb things everyday. Having well thought out political or moral opinions or even strong convictions about those opinions is hardly evidence that a person actually follows them. In the case of romantic attachments and sexual relations, men are remarkably, no, notoriously, weak. Consider Bill Clinton or David Petraeus. Sexual drives are incredibly resilient to moral theorizing because for so many men they are simply overwhelming. I’m not even sure from an evolutionary standpoint it is so remotely unintelligent (although you expressed it faultily) to spread his seed widely, no matter your feelings are about who he spreads his seed with. Although, like I said, if this woman was attractive and fit, reasonably intelligent as well, almost entirely white, and apparently motherly and decent, as the record indicates, I see little reason to think it was bad genetic “thinking”. While recognizing that this is by no means the only conception of rationallity, it seems quite rational genetically for him to do this. And the world simply wasn’t as it is now. A man of Jefferson’s stature and wealth would have had the capacity to achieve serious privacy, and given the mores of the times, few would have been barging into his house to crack this case. There was no paparazzi back then. There was speculation about Jefferson’s relationship with this woman, but it’s hard to prove without direct genetic evidence. Although now we know there was some relationship between a Jefferson and this woman. There is direct physical evidence for that.

        • DudeWheresMyCountry?

          There was speculation in his time and it was probably fueled by political dislike of Jefferson. There isn’t proof of a relationship other than that they obviously knew one another. She was in Paris for three years when Jefferson was Secretary of State but none of her children were born at that time so it was unlikely they had relations in France. We don’t know definitively so we are both speculating. I do find it hard to believe a sixty something man with health problems sired six kids though.

          • adplatt126

            Except widowed older men taking up slave concubines was fairly common. He wasn’t just in his sixties as this article indicates. The relationship likely began in the late 1880s or early 1890s, with Jefferson still in his mid, going on late forties and widowed for the better part of a decade by that time. She would have been more than 18 from that time forward, and for some time already a fully developed female. The last child of theirs would have been born when Jefferson was in his mid sixties, with the first four being birthed while Jefferson was in his early or mid 50s. That’s not really that old for a male. It’s neither shocking, surprising, rare or insulting. I consider it pretty standard really.

          • adplatt126

            Except widowed older men taking up slave concubines was fairly common. He wasn’t just in his sixties as this article indicates. The relationship likely began in the late 1880s or early 1890s, with Jefferson still in his mid, going on late forties and widowed for the better part of a decade by that time. She would have been more than 18 from that time forward, and for some time already a fully developed female. The last child of theirs would have been born when Jefferson was in his mid sixties, with the first four being birthed while Jefferson was in his early or mid 50s. That’s not really that old for a male. It’s neither shocking, surprising, rare or insulting. I consider it pretty standard really.

          • adplatt126

            Except widowed older men taking up slave concubines was fairly common. He wasn’t just in his sixties as this article indicates. The relationship likely began in the late 1880s or early 1890s, with Jefferson still in his mid, going on late forties and widowed for the better part of a decade by that time. She would have been more than 18 from that time forward, and for some time already a fully developed female. The last child of theirs would have been born when Jefferson was in his mid sixties, with the first four being birthed while Jefferson was in his early or mid 50s. That’s not really that old for a male. It’s neither shocking, surprising, rare or insulting. I consider it pretty standard really.

          • IanJMacDonald

            “The relationship likely began in the late 1880s or early 1890s,”

            When Jefferson was quite dead?

            You don’t know what you’re talking about.

          • adplatt126

            LOL. Don’t be silly. A simple typo. 1780s or early 1790s. I wouldn’t proffer a minor typing error as proof someone is off the mark.

          • IanJMacDonald

            There’s no evidence that such a relationship began in the 1780s or 1790s or at any time. Nothing except the sex-drenched imagination of lefties who hate America’s founders and heroes.

          • IanJMacDonald

            You don’t know when or if TJ had a “relationship” with Sally. You’re just making it up as you go along.

          • adplatt126

            Tomorrow perhaps I’ll locate a place you’ve left out a comma, and prove you don’t know anything by it. LOL. I know enough to know you don’t know anything since you offer a typo or a tiny oversight as proof a person is ignorant.

          • pcmustgo

            Yeah, a lot of the slave owners would sleep with the young slave girls cause they were YOUNG and their wives were aging and less appealing. SO they figured why not sleep with a young, nubile girl… men prefer younger women… Also, women, even white women, married and had children at age 14 back then.

        • Franklin Ryckaert

          “There were no paparazzi back then.”

          From what I gather from this article, that journalist James Callender who started this rumor, was a typical paparazzo. Such people are of all times.

        • Joseph U

          Are you black, or just a liberal egalitarian?

          “A man of Jefferson’s stature and wealth would have had the capacity to
          achieve serious privacy, and given the mores of the times, few would
          have been barging into his house to crack this case.”

          So, given that statement, we assume that the “most fit” mate that T. Jefferson could find would be a black slave; there were no accessible white women of similar social rank to to whom he might forward his affections; this was the best that he could do?

          “…if this woman was attractive and fit, reasonably intelligent as well,
          almost entirely white, and apparently motherly and decent, as the record
          indicates…”

          Yeah, -IF-.

          You accept this hearsay and supposition on it’s face but deny the written record of the man’s own views on the topic and corroborating hearsay indicating that it may have been the president’s young brother or his nephews who were reputed to have cavorted with the “darkies” with some regularity.

          Here we have at least three classically plausible motives for the propagation of this story:

          1. We’re the descendants of aristocracy. (blacks seem to love the idea that they are descended from kings and queens).

          2. It fits the “White oppression and rape of disadvantaged blacks” narrative.

          3. Money -If not the immediate descendants of Hemmings, the present hangers-on today who have created an industry of for-profit historical revision.

          As far as “African Oral Tradition”, it isn’t worth the paper it’s not written on. Blacks today claim such fantastical accomplishments as as founding Egyptian civilization and a comical list of putative inventions such as algebra, the electrochemical battery, aircraft and that Jesus of Nazareth was “black”.

          BZZZT! Oh, I’m sorry; maybe in the next round.

          • adplatt126

            As far as I can tell, most supposed conservatives are not that much more likely to be non-egalitarians than “liberals”. As it stands, I’m neither of the nouns you charge me with, but I’ll presume it’s a lack of basic ethics that is responsible for this silly ad hominem opening argument. As for your closing remarks and list, I deny none of these truths or claims. I’m just not sure that they’re really all that relevant to the issue. A person can believe one thing and behave contrarily. Most men in fact do, and certainly would if given the power to, which Jefferson certainly would have had over this young woman, especially when it comes to sexual matters. Besides, in such times, one can’t trust the alleged opinions of most political actors any more seriously than one can trust the professed opinions of modern politicians and their deep egalitarian values. Jefferson, even if he had somewhat different views than the record indicates, would have had little wiggle-room to express the nuances of his opinion during the early republic. What dismays me is the analytical skills of the people on this website, who seem unable to even consider the very strong possibility that Jefferson did in fact have children with this marginally black slave woman. It seems to me racial pride is overwhelmingly stronger than reason in most people on here. And by the way, Eston Hemings Jefferson, the offspring of this woman, was not only a successful free individual himself, after his migration to the north and acceptance in the white community, but was successful to the point that many of his descendants survive to this day, nearly all of them being classified as white*, all the way down the line, and still to this day. You can find some of their pictures online. So my claim that the decision was not a poor genetic decision seems buffered by the evidence, whether you like those facts or not. Or you can go on constructing an alternative reality you’re more comfortable with, and doctoring history so that it pleases your ego, much like the afro-centrists. Your choice.

          • Joseph

            Repost, just for you non-egalitarian liberal, non-black person:

            If so, then it is what it is and I’d accept the truth of it. Look at the T.J. quote that AmRen has right on the top bar.

            BUT- this is the typical nose under the the tent with these
            white-culture assassins. We will take the slimmest of evidence -wrap it
            in thick layers of hearsay and speculation and present it as a fact with
            which we can impugn the entirety of white civilization or elevate
            someone in a mud-hut. It is not even a preponderance of evidence which
            would be sufficient in a civil suit, let alone beyond reasonable doubt
            or minimal .95 confidence level for scientific publications but never
            mind, it is now established immutable fact.

            There is tremendous remaining evidence for example, of the
            fraudulence and infidelity of M.L. King but you can be damned sure that
            they don’t have an “expert in white oral tradition” presenting these
            stories to the public because that would cast aspersions on the
            apotheosis of the Civil Rights Movement. Again, another example of using
            different standards when comparing races which should be challenged.

            There simply is no defense for being white.

            In brief answer to your response, I am not claiming that this *could not* be true, nor that this never happens with saintly white people, nor (as I think that you read) that Hemming’s living descendants are making money off of this, though they may be. There certainly is a minor industry now arisen around this because I have seen “experts” on TV discussing this concrete DNA “proof”, which it is not. It is a part of a larger insidious agenda against which any “racist white” counterargument is dismissed.

            Fact has no color but is usually hard to come by.

          • scottthestrategerist

            You are the one who seems more motivated by an agenda than facts. I have been reading articles arguing against TJ as the father since 1998. It really does seem more likely that another Jefferson relative was the father, and if TJ was not a famous individual, but for some reason this paternity mystery existed anyway, no one would accuse the Old Man. Rather, all would see him as the least likely candidate.

          • ATBOTL

            “So, given that statement, we assume that the “most fit” mate that T. Jefferson could find would be a black slave; there were no accessible white women of similar social rank to to whom he might forward his affections; this was the best that he could do?”

            A 3/4 white(minimum) slave who was described as looking white and being attractive and whose father and grandfather were wealthy and socially prominent white men.

            Men don’t look for the most fit mate, anyway. Women do. Men look for all the mates they can get. Basic biology. See Bill Clinton.

          • pcmustgo

            Quadroon women (or men) look like Latinas… Italians or Jews… I say that as someone who is half jewish. I once met a quadroon male whom I swore looked just like one of the Jewish boys I grew up with. He was very insulted to be mistaken for a Jew! And when “the black elite” , all mulattoes , would “pass” into the white world, they would usually take on Jewish names and pretend to be Jewish.

          • scottthestrategerist

            Are you referring to Sephardic or Middle Eastern Jews? There are many white Jews in my city and all but the most stereotypical of them look identical to white gentiles.

          • pcmustgo

            Not identical, but they almost all certainly look “white”. I am half Jewish, btw, and perhaps that’s why I’m good at picking out Jewish and other ethnic features. I live in NYC, full of diversity and ethnics.

          • Carlos Geary

            There are white latinos. For example, Argentina, has the fifth place of people of Irish ancestry in the world. All over South America are million of people of German, Italian, ancestry. Startarting in the 1600 through 1940 South America, received millons of emigrants from Europe, s catholic people from Scandinavia, Holland, Germany, Ireland and other parts of

        • Luca

          Please take the following facts and add them to your thought process. TJ was a tall, attractive, intelligent man who had no problem wooing white women. I would think, like most men of his era, when given a choice he would go with his race, finding them to be more attractive. Secondly, I think TJ was intelligent and moral enough to know that 6 illegitimate slaves fathered by him would be a constant source of mockery and ruin his career, his reputation and his legacy. After being accused once, I don’t think he’d repeat the mistake 5 more times and with the exact same slave. Jefferson was a scholar and a man of science and new full well where babies come from, he would have employed any contraceptive devices, methods or practices available at the time to avoid any proof of his liaison. I think his profound grief over his wife’s death would have quelled most any desires remaining in a 50-60+ yr. old man not in the best of health. It was most likely a younger, healthier Jefferson male who had nothing to lose from the escapade.

      • http://countenance.wordpress.com/ Question Diversity

        The 1796-1804 time frame was probably the dirtiest and nastiest and most low down when it comes to Presidential politics and Federal politics in general in American history. You’re right — Any hint of TJ taking up with a slave and fathering kids by her would have hit the stratosphere.

  • Stentorian_Commentator

    On that kind of DNA evidence the OJ Simpson case would have been laughed out of court.

  • http://www.awpn.net/ Celestial Time

    What I find telling is that these same people will take a very tiny probability and turn it into an absolute certainty and an overwhelming indication of guilt, just because they need it to be seen that way, because a Jefferson brother, cousin, or nephew wouldn’t do them much good with their agenda . But give them an absolute certainty based on observation and facts(black crime, black intelligence, multiculturalism failures, MLK, etc.) and they will turn it into a tiny probability that only a “racist” would point out, or they will just completely ignore it and pretend like it doesn’t exist.

    As was mentioned, they don’t seem to hold their precious MLK to the same standards as Jefferson or any other White person.

    • Charles Edward Lincoln III

      Would you judge a swine by the same standard as a Saint? The fact that there is a federal holiday for Martin Luther King’s Birthday and none for Thomas Jefferson is just one of the horrible injustices and inequities of the topsy-turvy symbolic universe we live in. The really horrible irony is that Robert E. Lee’s birthday was still celebrated Statewide in Texas, Louisiana, and Virginia until quietly being dropped in the 1970s—some parts of Florida still celebrate (locally), but in Alabama, Arkansas, Georgia, and Mississippi, Lee has to share his birthday with MLK now:

      http://www.timeanddate.com/holidays/us/robert-e-lee-birthday
      “Quick Facts
      Robert E. Lee’s birthday is an annual official state holiday that is shared with Martin Luther King’s birthday in some parts of the United States.
      Robert E Lee’s Birthday English

      Día de Robert E Lee Spanish
      Alternative nameRobert E Lee Day
      Robert E Lee’s Birthday 2013Saturday, January 19, 2013 (local in Florida)
      Monday, January 21, 2013 (local in AL, AR, GA, MS)
      Robert E Lee’s Birthday 2014Sunday, January 19, 2014 (local in Florida)
      Monday, January 20, 2014 (local in AL, AR, GA, MS

      Martin Luther King was a swinish communist fraud—a little man with a big booming voice. I can’t wait until they decide to have a President Barack Obama day…. mostly I can’t wait to see whether he’ll declare his birthday a national holiday during his Presidency or afterwards….. what has happened to our Country, folks? This is New Year’s Day—it would be nice to think we have a future that isn’t so very…..dark…..

  • Michael Alan Prock

    This is off topic, but I can’t help but notice the Rembrandt Peale portrait at the top of the article portrays Jefferson with hazel (or maybe green) eyes and all the other portraits of him seem to show him with blue eyes. Peale’s the attention to detail in other respects seems as fine as any other portraits of Jefferson I can find, so it seems hard to believe he would make a mistake like that.
    Maybe one of our scholars out there knows?

    • http://www.awpn.net/ Celestial Time

      I’m no scholar, just someone who has read dozens of books and hundreds of letters and various writings by Jefferson.

      His eyes were generally considered to be light blue/gray, but I do believe they were the type that either changed to a slight degree during his lifetime, or at least people have described him as having hazel(ish) eyes with a gray/blue mixture. What was not in question was that his eyes were described as very light, so that makes it possible that all descriptions of his eye color could be accurate to at least some degree.

      With all this “diversity” that is claimed White people are missing, I find it astonishing that we are the only people on this planet that could be having this conversation of variety and diversity in our people.

      • Michael Alan Prock

        Thank you.
        My dad had gray eyes and depending on the light might have looked hazel(ish). The background in the Peale portrait is brown so that probably explains it.

  • JohnEngelman

    If Thomas Jefferson had an affair with Sally Hemmings it was almost certainly consensual, like Bill Clinton’s affair with Monica Lewinsky. Jefferson’s real sin was to have participated in America’s original sin. The United States would be a far better country if slavery and the slave trade had never existed.

    • Eric

      Given the America of that time, even if it was consensual, it was a de-facto consensual relatonship.

    • Luca

      Or was corrected in 1865.

    • MBlanc46

      Well said.

  • Nubian Times

    People defending a slaver, rapist and pedophile. No wonder so called white people are going extinct.

    • Franklin Ryckaert

      That’s what you hope, uh? But without “socalled” white people who will give you the bling-bling?

    • Sean

      Did you not read the article?

      The idea of “innocent until proven guilty” applies everywhere and I may add has helped quite a few of your people out. Use sources and evidence instead of being idiotic, don’t just spew anecdotal evidence over and over, the same thing you’ve accused another commenter of doing I may add.

      Many, MANY more blacks fall into those category currently than whites, even going back into history. Guess who sold your people into slavery (HINT: they were melanin enriched). Guess who commits the most rapes per capita in the USA (HINT: it’s not us). Guess where rape is so common and not even looked down upon that women from that place are systematically raped and murdered in truly soul crushing numbers (HINT: the Belgians used to own it. Another HINT: it’s in central Africa, I doubt the first hint would have helped you much). Guess whose home continent is a disgusting, filth ridden hell-hole that it has been declared beyond saving far too many times to count, this is a tough one. (HINT: not Europeans, nationals from either of the Americas, Asians, Australians, or even Antarcticans).

      Grow up, if you think that your people are somehow superior post sources that back you up. If you are correct I will dump my girlfriend and marry and black woman and throw away my blond hair and blue eyes so that no new generation may be cursed with “white privilege” even if they are from a white country. Just to add an extra layer of difficulty; only use actual scientific peer reviewed sources, no hear-say, no Afro-centric websites (I even capitalized the A, see how tolerant I am?).

      • Sean

        I apologize if I seem rude, I don’t suffer fools easily regardless of color.

  • JohnEngelman

    If Thomas Jefferson was not the father of Sally Heming’s children, at least one of his male relatives was. This is a controversy that will need to wait to be resolved until more precise methods of DNA testing are developed.

    • Joseph

      Agreed, it is yet a controversy.

  • JohnEngelman

    The terms “left” and “right” appeared during the French Revolution of 1789 when members of the National Assembly divided into supporters of the king to the president’s right and supporters of the revolution to his left.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Left%E2%80%93right_politics

    Those on the right in contemporary American politics often quote passages from the writings of Thomas Jefferson. Nevertheless, within the context of his era he was on the left. He supported the French Revolution until it turned bad with the Reign of Terror. He opposed the power of European aristocracies and the mercantile elite in the United States. He was one of the founders of what became the Democratic Party .

  • Baloocartoons

    Very nice and pleasantly revisionist. Linked here:

    http://ex-army.blogspot.com/2012/12/smearing-founders.html

  • You Are Now Enriched

    We are told that slave girls were raped by their evil, racist White masters, i.e. we are supposed to believe that black girls are all chaste and virginal until their wedding nights.

    Black girls would never temp massa into a liason that would result in a less ugly baby than the last one she made with full blooded, coal black kunte kente.

    Light skin has always be an elite marker for n’groes, even during slave times.

    And besides, since black girls are ALWAYS ovulating, they know that tempting massa will almost certainly profit.

    • haroldcrews

      It would never have crossed their minds that offering themselves to master could have resulted in preferential treatment either I’m sure.

      • scottthestrategerist

        Ouch! I’m sure glad I’m on your side!

  • icelandic

    Why in the 18th century did you have Octoroons, quadroons, hexadecaroons etc then? Certainly, all those very white looking black people didn’t just appear from a space ship. Sorry, I agree with Mr. Taylor on many things but not here. Jefferson, whom I’ve read nearly three dozen books on, had sex and pro-created with non- whites. It was what white males and even some female owners did. It is written within countless diaries and historical records and mainly in this country it is in 19th and early 20th century photos and faces of US Blacks who look all or near white. Mixed marriages were outlawed back then so slave rape and consensual sex was where their mostly white ancestry originated. That’s US and world history and frankly as a white person it does not threaten me.

    • pcmustgo

      Yes, I’ve even seen some pictures of slaves who were so white they did not look biracial or “mixed” or “quadroon” even… they looked purely white. Also, there are SOOO MANY WHITES I KNOW WITH AMER-INDIAN ANCESTRY. And you wouldn’t know. Except for their cheekbones, if that. They longer they’ve been in this country ancestry wise, the more likely that was to happen.

    • pcmustgo

      Also, here’s the deal. While this did occur, this rape or mixing, it was RARE… MOST, MOST, THE OVERWHELMING MAJORITY OF PICTURES I’VE SEEN OF FREED BLACK PLANTATION SLAVES WERE PITCH BLACK… no mulattoes in site. Most blacks trace their white blood back to a “white grandfather” who was with the black women long after slavery had been banned, like more around 1900 or the 1920’s.

      White mixing with black was much more rare here than in Brazil.

      • pcmustgo

        so yes, this slaver/master rape did occur, but it was more rare than afro-centrists claim.

    • Epiminondas

      Icelandic, can you offer any proof for your assertions? If you read the article above, what do you know that refutes what is presented here? We’re all waiting breathlessly for your trove of information supporting this charge of yours regarding Mr. Jefferson. Either tell us what you know or please slither back to your iceberg.

  • David Ashton

    Retired President Jefferson was walking home late one evening past his plantation, after spending all his cash on a scholarly study in Gaelic of the banking system, when suddenly a young, scantily dressed half-breed girl appeared at the roadside, and said: “Would you like to sleep with me for $10?”
    Jefferson replied: “Well, I’m not really tired, but I could do with the money.”
    And that’s how it all began, said Uncle Remus.

  • razorrare

    Read all the interesting comments at Taki mag…and wondering if J.T.will respond to John Derbyshire who wrote…

    Jared: The story about Thos. Eston Hemings having been fathered by Thos. Jefferson is told again in Bryan Sykes’ latest book (DNA USA, 2012, pp. 72-74). Sykes says that the “genetic evidence proved, beyond reasonable doubt, that [the story] was true.” He gives a quick summary of that evidence.

    I haven’t looked into details of the controversy, and Sykes strives mightily to keep his PC credibility on race topics; but the guy is a professor of human genetics.

    • razorrare

      another interesting tidbit i gathered from reading the comments at Taki mag was this…Sally Hemmings was the half-sister of Thomas Jeffersons deceased wife…

  • carole smith

    I always knew this whole Sally Hemings things was a bunch of hooey, and this article just confirms it. So, Thomas was only Sally’s children’s Uncle Tom, not the baby daddy.

  • LHathaway

    Lefties are weirdos. . . they’re trying to ‘defame’ jefferson by saying he has sex with black women. Shouldn’t true leftists be praising him for the same reason?

    • Der Typ

      Much like the Hitler had Jewish ancestors charge. Even if it that is true, are you sure that is the stand you want to take? It’s not that weird though. They aren’t interested in the pursuit of facts or history per say; they find facts are only useful when they can be used as weapons. They aren’t even arguments actually. They are the introductory statement to an argument you are already supposed to have learned in school. The fact that one can take many different interpretations from the ‘facts’ isn’t really taught anymore. For example, when discussing Hitler in circumstances where I can’t get fired, and the inevitable person says, “but wasn’t Hitler partially Jewish?” I always reply, “Are you sure that that isn’t an argument against miscegenation?” Even if TJ did father those children, I’m not going to throw the baby out with the bath water and disregard everything he’s said (imagine if we held black leaders to a similar standard). Besides to quote Christ, “let he who is without sin, cast the first stone.” Show me someone who hasn’t been a hypocrite at some point, particularly on the left.

      I don’t find leftists to be weird, but their motivations perplex the hell out of me.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Mark-Caplan/778438601 Mark Caplan

    Jefferson doesn’t fair too well in Ron Chernow’s WASHINGTON: A LIFE. Chernow quotes a letter of Martha Washington’s saying that a social call by Jefferson to Mount Vernon was “the second worst day of my life.” (The worst was the day her husband died.) The Washingtons had good reason to detest Jefferson. He was devious, duplicitous, and given to wild, unsubstantiated accusations that members of Washington’s political party were crypto-monarchists. Today we’d call him a wingnut, a birther, a conspiracy theorist. I still admire Jefferson tremendously for his vast learning and accomplishments, but he definitely had some serious flaws. Whether he had sex with his wife’s half-sister, a pretty quadroon slave, seems a matter of very slight importance.

  • vcarvega

    The fallacy in this article is that it is trying to disprove Jefferson sleeping with slaves without actually offering any evidence of its own… Truthfully, it is just as likely as it is unlikely. It was common practice for slave owners to sleep with their slaves at that time. Even today, white men and women seem largely attracted to races of color… to the extent that white women want fuller lips and figures that they seem to have lost genetically. Given that the cradle of civilization was in the Middle Eastern/North African region, I believe there is something innate within us that recognizes that “original” man or woman as the ideal image of beauty. Since all races had to have come from one race at some point… it makes sense that on some level we seek to contribute our genes for the recreation of that master race.