The Liberal Creationists

Steve Sailer, Takimag, April 30, 2014

{snip}

Nicholas Wade, the New York Times’ chief genetics reporter, has published 1,052 articles in the newspaper of record since 1983. For most of this century, Wade has been methodically waging war in the Science section of the NYT against the liberal creationist myth that race isn’t real. He has now written a definitive book on the existence of biological differences among races, A Troublesome Inheritance: Genes, Race and Human History, which will be published on May 6.

In his new book, Wade writes:

Ever since the first modern humans dispersed from the ancestral homeland in northeast Africa . . . the populations on each continent have evolved largely independently of one another as each adapted to its regional environment. . . . Because of these divisions in the human population, anyone interested in recent human evolution is almost inevitably studying human races, whether they wish to or not.

To Wade, race isn’t just skin deep. In fact, he finds the visual differences between races less significant than the behavioral. Evolution’s strategy for adapting to radically different environments is to “keep the human body much the same but change the social behavior.”

For example, in one study, the variant of the MAO-A gene most associated with aggression and delinquency was found in 5.2 percent of a sample of black males but only 0.1 percent of Caucasian males, which may explain a lot.

{snip}

The inability of a first-rate reporter like Wade, ensconced in the seeming bully pulpit of the New York Times, to make much of an impact makes for a fascinating case study of the zeitgeist’s power to cloud the minds of men.

I first documented what Wade was saying about race in the NYT at VDARE.com in 2003, then returned to the subject in 2006 when reviewing Wade’s book on prehistory, Before the Dawn. But I scratch out a living by reading very closely, so I notice things.

{snip}

A Troublesome Inheritance is based in sizable part on the work of a rogue’s gallery of crimethinkers such as Gregory Cochran on Jewish IQ, Richard Lynn on global IQ, Ron Unz on Chinese Social Darwinism, Gregory Clark on the evolution of the bourgeois virtues among the English, and Steven Pinker on the decline in violence. {snip}

{snip}

Extrapolating from Clark’s 2007 book A Farewell to Alms, which argued for the evolutionary benefits to Eurasians of being selected for fitness to survive in densely populated or otherwise difficult regions, Wade observes:

African populations have not gone through the same Malthusian wringer that shaped the behavior of the European and East Asian populations. Between 1200 and 1800, the English, adapting to the harsh pressures of an intense agrarian economy, became less violent, more literate and more willing to save for the future. In Africa, population pressure has long been much lower than in Europe and Asia . . .

European cultures tried to keep population below the famine level by inculcating the sexual restraint and romantic choosiness conducive to relatively late marriages, while East Asian cultures cultivated grinding work ethics. In most of tropical Africa, however, the infectious disease burden was so lethal that dense populations could not be achieved due to epidemics. So the population could not form cities, nor even fully farm the countryside. The big danger in Africa was not Malthusian overpopulation, but underpopulation, which may account for how sexualized their cultures are.

Not surprisingly, each continent’s culture seems to have bred people befitting its environment, and their traits live on in their descendants in modern America.

{snip}

[Editor’s Note: See here for our review of this important book.]

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  • When lies are so easily accepted and so enthusiastically spread, it means that powerful people benefit from those lies being accepted as truth.

    • Anon

      I hold the opposite opinion. When a small, extremely hostile, alien minority is able to control a large group of much stronger, much smarter people simply by telling them easily refuted, commonly observable, bald faced lies, the group they are controlling has become decadent and corrupt to the point of absurdity.
      The worst part about the 1984 like situation we have today is how little effort they have to make and the fact that the truth is easily and instantly available for all to see for themselves.
      And no one bothers.

      • Chip Carver

        A hostile, genocidal alien minority is able to control a large group of people when the minority is highly organized and works as group. And if the alien minority works as a group amongst a highly atomized majority. An unaware majority. But circumstances will force those unaware white folks into the reality of what’s happening. Then we will hear the howls and screams of denial and persecution from the Usual Suspects in earnest when the curtain is pulled back, and they are revealed in all their money grubbing, hate mongering glory.

        The problem is that it is going to have to get worse before it gets better.

        • Cannot Tell

          I used to have hope that as the West deteriorates whites would accept race realism. But I recently learned that even some white South Africans hold egalitarian views. I have only anecdotal evidence, but I know for a fact that there are white South Africans that believe they are targeted by blacks solely because they have money. Some of them don’t accept that blacks simply hate whites and some of them don’t accept race realism. If the dysfunction of South Africa cannot convince whites that blacks are biologically different and incapable of building first world societies I don’t know what can.

          I’m sorry if I sound pessimistic. I’m just trying to be realistic.

      • AndrewInterrupted

        We are indeed in Orwellian times.
        Both 1984 and Animal Farm are omnipresent.

    • Einsatzgrenadier

      The opinions of QD and Anon are easily reconciled. Whether the cosmopolitan elite actually *believes* in universal egalitarianism and third world immigration-fueled multiculturalism is irrelevant. What does matter is that they benefit enormously from the large-scale dissemination of these beliefs, especially in terms of increased wealth and power. These beliefs are readily accepted by the masses, without ideological opposition, because of years of large-scale indoctrination in epistemological relativism, combined with the deleterious, pacificatory influence of bread and circuses, routinely dished out to an unsuspecting public by our liberal tyrants. Furthermore, the indoctrination and pacification of the masses has destroyed the capacity of the body politic to successfully integrate group members into a socially cohesive group identity, leading to widespread cultural malaise and anomie in all modern western societies.

  • CJ Haze

    Race is a social construct. If you don’t believe that, you’re racist.

    ——–

    This is Newspeak.

    • Urbane Neanderthal

      I say racism is a social construct since according to the “enlightened” there is only one race.

      • APaige

        Well…I only care about one race. Those whose ancestors came from the small northwestern area of Eurasia.

    • Chip Carver

      Are racists a social construct? After all, Urbane Neanderthal’s comment makes sense. So carrying it half a step farther…

  • LovelyNordicHeidi

    To Wade, race isn’t just skin deep. In fact, he finds the visual differences between races less significant than the behavioral. Evolution’s strategy for adapting to radically different environments is to “keep the human body much the same but change the social behavior.”
    ———————————————————————–
    I think that it is really courageous of Wade to stand for the truth and only for the truth. We need more people like him to spread the truth. Everyone must know. Everyone must hear. Everyone must be awakened.

  • Daniel Schmuhl

    This isn’t really some revolutionary event, it will just be a good book. From the previews I’ve seen it’s not really much more controversial than his earlier book, Before the Dawn.

    Some people seem to mistakenly believe that the quasi-religion of political correctness can be defeated by just putting the facts out there. The HBD stuff is fascinating but Cthulhu is still swimming left. Race realism has mostly resulted in an internet subculture and that’s it.

    • JohnEngelman

      Race realism is discredited by its association with white nationalism.

      • Einsatzgrenadier

        Race realism and white nationalism go hand in hand. It’s a biological fact that people favor those whom they perceive as most genetically similar to themselves.

        • Strike_Team

          LOL. They’re back, posing as one of their favorite troll identities.

        • JohnEngelman

          Then why is it that interracial marriage is not even an issue any more? When George H.W. Bush nominated Clarence Thomas for the the Supreme Court I do not remember any Republicans – even rank and file Republicans – complaining that Clarence Thomas had a white wife. They simply wanted him to join the Supreme Court.

          • Einsatzgrenadier

            If interracial marriage is not an issue any more, why is it that the vast majority of whites still prefer to marry members of their own race?

      • Brian

        You should wag your finger at the Orientals you are so fond of, who have even stronger yellow nationalism. I’ve never heard a Japanese, Chinese, or Korean utter the dreaded words ‘diversity is our strength’. Good for them.

        • JohnEngelman

          Diversity is not our strength. It is our problem, and one we need to manage.

          The deportation of non whites and Jews is an idle fantasy. So is secession and a white ethno state.

          • Alexandra1973

            Operation Wetback seemed to work.

          • JohnEngelman

            I agree.

            Unlike most Americans I am in favor of locating illegal immigrants, deporting them, and punishing their employers.

          • Chip Carver

            Did you ever notice that the usual suspects state that things that could and may happen are “fantasy”? Heck, the Bolsheviks themselves hauled people all over the Soviet Union, by the millions, almost 100 years ago, moving ethnic groups around, dropping them into different regions to create conflict. To keep the divide and conquer mode going full tilt. This is exactly what they’re doing now in the West via non-white immigration.

            With all the land the usual suspects bought in Patagonia “just in case” they have to make an en-masse run for it, you can see that they do think there’s a chance things could tank in the US, Europe, the “Middle East” and every other infected region on the plant.

          • Kalashnikov

            No need to deport, at least in the case of blacks. Just stop feeding them and paying for their healthcare and their numbers will dwindle. Stop fortifying foods with Vitamin D and the effect will be accelerated.

          • Martel

            Seccesion is always the final product of a multi ethnic society. As even Asians fail to integrate, the cream of the crop from a nation of peasants, this becomes closer every day. The US, due to its enormous financial and military resources, and low pop density will ”sing it out” a bit longer then other multi ethnic nations,on the other hand, blacks and Mexicans will raise the tensions a lot quicker then expected with say, different ethnicities in former Yugoslavia.

          • JohnEngelman

            The states with the most white nationalists also have the most blacks. I doubt those blacks will submit to second class citizenship like they did when Reconstruction came to an end.

            Deportation of blacks failed in the United States when the black population was much lower. Few blacks wanted to leave. Few whites wanted to pay for their one way transportation out. No countries welcomed them.

            Because deportation failed then I am confident it will fail now.

          • Martel

            Blacks don’t have to submit, societies just fall apart eventually, over half of white millennials already see the natural inequities in a multi ethnic society,even though they are overwhelmed by propaganda, they are already making the first steps to understanding the necessity for ethnic activism. . Societies no longer bound by ethnicity must fall apart, it will be ugly, exactly because whites were foolish enough not to deport blacks.

          • JohnEngelman

            Whites were foolish when they allowed the slave trade. That is when the most important mistake happened.

            Southern whites should have grown their own tobacco and cotton.

          • LACountyRedneck

            Orania much?

      • FeuerSalamander

        Zionism is jewish nationalism. I guess you like to cherry pick your nationalisms. What is good for me is bad for thee eh englegolem?

        • JohnEngelman

          I believe that the electorate in every country has the right to decide who can move to that country and become a citizen, and who cannot.

          Israel already has a population of about twenty percent Arabs. Most of these are citizens with citizenship rights. Israel is also about the size of Rhode Island. Therefore, I do not begrudge the insistence of most Israelis that new immigrants be Jews.

          • Chip Carver

            Like FeuerSalamander stated, cherry-picking.

        • Chip Carver

          Cherry-picking it is.

          I also have some doubts as to the level of self-deception practiced by these people. They know exactly what’s going on. Then rationalize it. Then when countered and blocked, they go into denial and spit the same tired bromides at everyone.

      • Cambrian Smith

        Every race expresses some degree of nationalism because it serves their interests. White failure to do so as well would be self destructive. Why would a group not be interested in having a majority status? Jews in Israel will have a fun time there once they become minorities, I’m sure. Maybe they just need more Africans and Arabs, if you genuinely think nationalism serves to discredit the science of race realism. I can’t see how you’ve got a point.

    • Brian

      Race realism has mostly resulted in an internet subculture and that’s it.
      ===
      It’s been the entry point for many of us to explore the political ramifications.

      • JohnEngelman

        The internet eases the dissemination of facts and ideas. Nevertheless, one must be able to tell which sources of factual data are credible, and which are not.

        Anyone can find something on the internet he or she agrees with. Just because one wants to believe something does not mean that it is true.

  • David Ashton

    This is still a provisional stage on a long scientific journey. “Out of Africa” may need revision. What we do have is the existing evidence of genetic differences between existing populations.

    But how many US Baptists agree with the Jehovah’s Witnesses that “all of us descended from Noah’s sons” (“Racism”, Awake!, April 2014)? “UNESCO states that ‘all human beings…are descended from a common stock'” [1978] op.cit. Noah is supposed to have emerged from the ark about four thousand years ago!

  • Tarczan

    I hate to say it, but this stuff bores me now. I know racial differences exist, and I expect the science will at some point catch up with what any observer of the human condition understands as fact.

    • FeuerSalamander

      It sounds like they are STILL making excuses for blacks. IT be the disease!

  • FeuerSalamander

    So much of this is sounds like nonsensical conjecture. The author confuses behavior and culture changes with genetics. To suggest that the reason blacks did not form cities was because of disease rates ignores the fact that they still can not form cites, just destroy them. They benefit from western medicine to the point where their population has greatly increased, yet this has not changed their intelligence nor their behavior.

    • foundingstockcracker

      Just reworked Boasian bullpucky.

      • FeuerSalamander

        Academics are so in love with the theory of evolution that they postulate it as the reason for everything. For instance , some state that the passivity of modern whites is due to a culling of more violent whites over a few centuries. A much more likely reason is the relative prosperity and comfort of modern whites.

    • Brian

      The author infers that a change to a harsh agrarian economy caused a change in English genetics. There is no proof of this.
      ===
      Have you studied the literature enough to say that definitively?

      Did European genes decline with the fall of the Roman empire and then bounce back later on?
      ===
      What? Genes ‘decline’ and ‘bounce back’? Okay, now I know you haven’t read the literature.

      They benefit from western medicine to the point where their population
      has greatly increased, yet this has not changed their intelligence nor
      their behavior.
      ===
      Why would they need to change, as long as they have us to generously support them? Their numbers in the US are 100x the number of slaves brought here. From the evolutionary standpoint, whatever they’re doing, as destructive as it is to our social, economic, and technological progress, has been enormously successful for their reproduction. Now if we pulled the rug out from under them by leaving them to their own devices…if the ER and EBT were not available, that would be a whole different story.

      • FeuerSalamander

        the theory that white success since the 1800s is due to an evolution of white genetics necessitates the idea white genetics changed. Yes, that is ridiculous, and that is what I am saying. I am saying that to postulate that the successes of Europeans being tied to genetics would mean that during Roman times genetics of Europeans were superior to genetics during the dark ages, and that n=modern European genes would also have to be superior to those of the dark ages. Yes, of course this is ridiculous, it is not my fault that the author can not see the utter nonsense of his ideas. White genetics are constant. The abilities of whites are constant, the nature of whites is constant. Other circumstances changed. THAT is the explanation that makes more sense. Sorry YOIU can not understand a simple post.

        • Brian

          the theory that white success since the 1800s is due to an evolution of
          white genetics necessitates the idea white genetics changed.

          ===

          It doesn’t mean that the genes changed _during the same period_ of progress, only that it had occurred by that point. The evolutionary adaptations that enabled the European explosion of invention and wealth after 1500AD happened between the last ice age and the medieval period. And when the cultural precursors came online, everything was in place. If I want to buy a $30k car today, in cash, there is no restriction on WHEN I came up with the money– only that I have it today. I could have won the lottery yesterday, run a super-successful lemonade stand when I was eight, or earned it steadily since college. Doesn’t matter.

          I am saying that to postulate that the successes of Europeans being tied to genetics would mean that during Roman times genetics of Europeans were superior to genetics during the dark ages
          ===
          No, it wouldn’t. Because no one thinks that genetics is the sole determining factor of social outcomes. Do you think that the rising temperature between dawn and noon implies global warming, because there can’t be more than one cause of changing temperature?

          White genetics are constant.
          ===
          No species’ gene pool is constant, ever. It changes every time offspring are produced.

          • Alexandra1973

            Look at the religious standpoint. The Dark Ages were “dark” because the Vatican ruled the known world. It was the Reformation that helped put an end to that. When did the Reformation happen? Right around 1500 AD.

          • Brian

            The ‘dark ages’ ended by 1000, not 1500. By 1500 the Middle Ages were done too, and the Renaissance had been under way for 150 years. This sounds more like a convenient way for a Protestant to beat up on Catholics to me, but there’s probably some merit to it, at least in the sense that after Luther you had more religious ‘competition’ and less of a religious stranglehold on economic development and invention…someone getting persecuted in a Catholic country could try to move to a Protestant one, or vice versa.

          • tlk244182

            Vice versa. If I’m not mistaken, Kepler had to flee from the Lutherans, who wanted to burn him at the stake for suggesting a heliocentric solar system, to the protection of the wicked, unscientific, benighted Jesuits.

    • Anna Tree

      I didn’t read the book yet, but only from articles on it, it seems that Mr. Wade doesn’t take into account that Eurasian mated with Neanderthals while those who stayed in Africa didn’t. And also that those who stayed in Africa continued to mate with other African homonids or even homonins while the Eurasian didn’t.

      But at least this book is in libraries (unlike unfortunately racialist books).

    • Anna Tree

      Exactly FeuerSalamander.

      The West achieved its dominance long before the Italian Renaissance.

      And the Middle Age weren’t really dark ages, it is just the people living the Renaissance looked at the previous generations with a better-than-thee attitude.

      From Michael Crichton’s book Timeline: “We owe much to the Middle Age. Our present Western world is more the result of the Middle Ages than the Renaissance. The Renaissance gave us art and and freedoms but those were
      already won in the Middle Ages. The Middle Ages gave us the nation-states, the central government and urban life, the universities and the codes of law and ideas of justice, well also the government bureaucracies, and dozens of other institutions.

      They weren’t gloomy and stagnant, it was much an exciting time. A period of change, movement and travel. The English longbow ended the knights status in a few decades. New, more efficient methods of plowing, fertilizing and crop rotation revolutionalized the agricultural methods. The medieval social order was not fixed and many new enriched families found their way into the nobility. Women had no legal rights but they were prime players in what was happening and had the right to take care of the businesses and other family affairs like the defense of the castle against besieging armies. It was a time of terrible disease,
      but also of joy in life and appreciation of its preciousness maybe more than today.”

      And then of course like you said before the Renaissance and Middle age, there was the Roman Empire, and before that Ancient Greece, and before that Ancient Egypt. And also the Phoenicians, Sumerans etc who are not Europeans but still were whites (well before islam and miscegenation with black slaves – the latter is in my opinion another reason for the decline of the Ancient Italians/Portuguese/greeks/Egyptians).

    • ThomasER916

      I was going to simply say this:

      The author is dancing around Lamarckian Evolution.

  • FeuerSalamander

    Even libs can no longer deny the vast differences between the races. The vast differences in ability, behavior, violence etc. But they are still trying to find and excuse for blacks. It was the diseases don’t you know. IF there had just been larger numbers of blacks then they would have built cities etc. Maybe if their intelligence and behavior were like humans, they would have been able to turn that rich continent into a fertile land of abundance the way the whites did when they colonized it. Today they are trying to give the white owned farms in South Africa to blacks, and the blacks always fail.

  • Tom Thumb

    Yeah, sure. Here’s what I say to those nut jobs that espouse that baloney. Take a walk through downtown Camden, N.J. on a hot Aug. night around 2:30 AM and if you live, come and tell me race is only a “social construct.”

  • Anon

    It is extremely dangerous to attribute easily observed common sense issue like race to pseudo-science and theories that cannot be tested with today’s technology, if at all.
    Evolution has the dubious honor of being the most tested theory ever developed….and has failed every single test of it, across multiple scientific disciplines for several generations now. To say it is wrong is a tremendous understatement. Parts of the theory are patently absurd (like the idea of the primordial ooze, which, oh, I don’t know, violates the prime tenant of biology). To base more theory on the supposition that it is true…..well….that is unlikely to be fruitful.
    Perhaps there is a genetic basis of race. And perhaps, thousands of years from now, we might know enough about genes that the statement actually has some use or even meaning. Today, it does not. You can tell a person’s race by their genes but really, what does that mean? You can also tell a person’s race by simply examining a sample of their hair under a microscope. It means nothing. And, because it means nothing, it is a handy excuse to simply dismiss everything else about race.
    The fact that more black males than not, commit a rape, robbery, murder or serious assault, is IMPORTANT. The fact that whites do not….important. The fact that it’s always been this way. Important. The theory that, because of this, race is the important issue when addressing violence in society, is on very strong footing.
    Talking about a non-observable genetic cause of all this is very weak, invites red herring issues and false denials of reality….(ie prove the exact genes that cause the violence….impossible to do) when in fact, the above stands on its own.
    Also, understand that anti-racists care nothing for science. Spend a hundred years and trillions of dollars proving racism is correct via science and they will simply stop using science and burn you at the stake as a heretic.

    • a multiracial lndividual

      The evidence in favor of natural selection is staggering. It is not possible to make an intelligent argument against natural selection anymore. Comparative anatomy, comparative genetics, fossil comparison, geographic distribution of extinct and living species, etc. All of these are telling the same story. You’re never gonna find the fossil remains of a mammal in pre-Cambrian rock.

      • Alexandra1973

        Interestingly enough the Bible mentions the earth being divided. So there’s Biblical evidence for a supercontinent.

        Natural selection? If man evolved from monkeys…why are there still monkeys around?

        • a multiracial individual

          If im not too mistaken, evolution creates a tree structure (with branches) . It is not a “ladder.” That is why primates are still around. When Pangea (the supercontinent) existed, humans did not. Not all Christians read the book of Genesis literally. Many read it symbolically.

        • Kalashnikov

          Because humans didn’t descend from modern apes. We shared a common ancestor long ago. At some point populations of that ancestor were separated and followed different paths with different selection pressures. One group became human and the other(s) became the great apes.

          • JohnEngelman

            The divergence happened after the evolution of the first ape. Humans and Chimpanzees share a common ancestor who lived about six million years ago. Humans and Chimpanzees are more closely related than either species is related to the other apes.

        • JohnEngelman

          The first species of ape evolved from a monkey. In time that ape divided into several species of ape. One of those evolved into humans.

  • Alexandra1973

    You can be a creationist and still be a race realist; the two are not mutually exclusive.

    Read the account of what Noah’s son Ham did to him. If blacks want someone to blame, blame Ham.

    • Katherine McChesney

      I commented once about Ham and my remark was deleted. Funny thing that.

      • Alexandra1973

        Not all of us believe the *theory* of evolution, I just wish some people would get that.

        I also think that Christians are more likely to be anti-racist because, after all, racism is tied in with evolution somehow. If Darwin believed it, we don’t. Well, Darwin was right about a few things–the “origin of species” is not one of them, however.

        As a friend of mine says, eat the meat and throw away the bones.

    • a multiracial individual

      How was the Earth repopulated after the flood WITHOUT everyone committing incest?

      • Alexandra1973

        I’m sure God made some kind of allowance.

        Suppose evolution was true. Don’t you think there would have been plenty of instances of incest in that case? You didn’t just suddenly have a thousand of one kind of animal.

      • Kalashnikov

        Magic primarily. It also helps if no one ever asks the question. Just better all around.

  • Daniel Schmuhl

    What about the Stormfront creationists who believe whites to be superior to Jews and Asians in terms of IQ when all the data says not really.

    • Alexandra1973

      It doesn’t bother me to acknowledge if another race has a superior overall IQ.

      I’m half Polish and I know there’s the “dumb Pollack” stereotype. I just like to say my German ancestry made up for it. 🙂

      • Daniel Schmuhl

        Poland has a lower IQ than Germany, but I doubt that this is due to genetics.

        • Alexandra1973

          I’ve heard that out of Whites, Slavics have the lowest IQ overall, and Germans the highest.

          Honking my own horn here…I was in gifted and accelerated classes in school. Not that it means much when you realize that they take the smart kids and try to indoctrinate them with all the leftist claptrap, because the common knowledge, as I put it, is that liberals are enlightened, and conservatives are ignorant and backward.

          Well…I have a high IQ and I’m a Christian and a conservative.

          • Daniel Schmuhl

            Not quite, many Southern European populations have lower average IQs. I’m just not convinced that it’s due to genes, especially considering other differences. Eastern and Central Europe were under Communist governments until a few decades ago.

            I’m a high IQ atheist with some right-wing political believes. It’s kind of unusual because high IQ people are generally liberal.

          • Alexandra1973

            I think it’s because schools indoctrinate the smarter kids. It seems to be the prevailing belief that liberalism=enlightenment and conservatism=backward and stupid.

          • Daniel Schmuhl

            I doubt that fully explains it to be honest. If you look at 19th century intellectuals such as John Stuart Mill, you will see that intellectuals in general were much more left-wing than the majority. Bruce Charlton has said that many smart people are clever sillies, they rely too much on novel thinking instead of intuition.

            I think it might be the case that without any sort of religious basis, intellectuals will drift towards delusional leftist beliefs simply because they’re more comforting and there is little incentive to believe in the truth. Combine this with the fact that the human mind is hard-wired for belief. When people stop believing in justice in the next life, they will try to find it on Earth. So most non-religious people are likely to be social justice warriors.

            Sometimes there is an incentive to be correct, if an engineer ignores the laws of physics his career is over. But in some domains there is no incentive or the incentives are perverse. They can be rationally irrational in other words. Many smart people are rationally irrational. Without any religious enforcement, truth becomes optional.

          • a multiracial individual

            This is how it was explained to me. High IQ people are usually all socially liberal, and many are economically liberal as well. Low IQ people are disproportionately represented among socially conservative people.

            1. Social liberal, economic conservative: Your average libertarian. Has no strange concerns about sex, substance abuse, gambling, and other victimless crimes. However, they see that liberal spending/regulation is insane (especially in a diverse society).

            2. Social liberal , economic liberal: Your average San Franciscan that is lucky enough to live far away from reality.

            3. Social conservative, economic conservative: Your average poor, uneducated, Southern White.

            4. Social conservative, economic liberal: Your basic ghetto dweller, usually very religious and very homophobic.

            This is adapted from a previous post by an Amrener.

          • ThomasER916

            Whenever someone says “homophobic”, they’ve disqualified themselves as a Useful Idiot for Cultural Marxism.

          • Alexandra1973

            I am socially and economically conservative. I am a lifelong Yankee, I completed high school and I went through a trade school.

            By “uneducated” do you mean “not indoctrinated”?

            My dad only went to the sixth grade but he was pretty smart.

          • Strike_Team

            I think the liberals are the ones who started the myth of high IQ people being liberal. After all, blacks and hispanics are very liberal, despite media claims regarding how conservative they are because of religious beliefs. It’s all a smokescreen.

            As for intelligent whites being liberal, I see naive but intelligent whites who are liberal. Take race for example; once any of these “intelligent” people are forced into reality via a real sit down with a black or hispanic they tend to wake up. By “sit down” I mean a good ol’ fashioned beat down for a wallet, purse, knockout game, home-invasion…whatever idea pops into the head of the dark colored person at that moment. And they act on those ideas right quick.

            In my experience, it’s a lot of the “average” or just below average whites who stay liberal, even after reality gives them a busted nose. Because they are so brainwashed. The more intelligent people will sometimes pretend to still be liberal, so they can stick with the “in crowd”, but they know the score.

            Sure, there are intelligent liberals. Are they the majority. No. But the people controlling them, giving them signals, are in charge. And those people pretend to be liberal, when in fact their support for liberal ideas is based on using those ideas to destroy a society. Because once they are in position to take the masks off, they aren’t very liberal anymore. Just ask the folks who had to live under them in Soviet Russia.

          • Daniel Schmuhl

            That is wrong though. Blacks and Hispanics are socially conservative, and economically gibsmedat. The tests usually measure social beliefs.

          • Chip Carver

            When have blacks and Hispanics shown themselves to be socially conservative in the real world? Not in testing or via tests. The real world. They’re not. They’re not intelligent enough to exercise socially conservative behavior.

            The only people who tell us that blacks and Hispanics are social conservatives are the liars in the media. The same liars that tell us that Latinos have such stellar family values and are “natural republicans”.

          • Anna Tree

            Educated and intelligent are two different things.

            Also, blind faith doesn’t only revolves around a god: any kind of brainwashing and wishful thinking can impede one’s smartness.

          • newscomments70

            I find that in California, that a high percentage of white liberal males are noticeably effeminate. I assume they are homosexuals, but they could be heterosexual beta males. I honestly don’t want to know. On the street, they could pass as homosexuals. On the internet, if you disagree with them, they become keyboard warriors, spewing every hateful insult imaginable. Their common reponse is, “soon you will be a minority, and we can have peace, justice and tolerance.” I warn them that black and hispanic communities are extremly racist and homophobic. They can expect their lives to be in grave danger in the future diverse America. Their lives are protected by white police and military, most of whom are conservative. Without this “evil” presence, their lives basically are over. Even now in Los Angeles, gays are often attacked by blacks and hispanics. The courts seem to side with the attackers if the victim is white. it is not even considered a hate crime. I also warn them that most policemen probably dislike them. I honestly don’t know if that is a fact, because I am not in law enforcement. Again, they laugh at me, completely ingorning any facts or common sense. For my own reference, please advise on what the majority of police think of white, liberal homosexuals. (all cops, including other races.)

      • ThomasER916

        That stereotype actually comes from Jews. It comes from the Ashkenazi in Germany and their contempt for the shtetl Jews in Poland. This contempt is found in Marx’s writings from “The People’s Papers” in 1861, though the actual contempt is found much earlier.

    • JohnEngelman

      An honest race realist acknowledges the higher average IQ’s of Ashkenazi Jews and Orientals to white Gentiles.

      • Katherine McChesney

        I’m disappointed that you returned to Amren. Your remarks are boring and you are racist against Whites. But, that what we should expect from a Liberal such as yourself.

      • Paul

        Lol, here he is again. With his two favourite non-white races that would never have proigressed passed the 18th century without whites. Again we have to wonder why he keeps coming here.

      • Alexandra1973

        We’re not denying that. But that doesn’t mean that we want to be replaced by them.

        Look at it from this standpoint: If Ashkenazis and Orientals mixed with us (miscegenation), wouldn’t that lower *their* IQ? Is that something they want?

        I readily acknowledge it, but I’m still happy being White. I’m happy doing things I’m able to do. Languages is my thing.

      • Fathercoughlin

        and both are trash. IQ isnt everything

      • Einsatzgrenadier

        An honest race realist is also willing to acknowledge that there is a substantial body of evidence indicating that Orientals do not have higher IQs than whites. In fact, there is evidence that Orientals have lower IQs than whites.

        • Strike_Team

          Ignore the troll team. Then again, maybe it’s a real person. If so, then I guess their bender for several weeks (on Asian porn sites) has come to an end.

          As for an end to anything, all anyone has to do is point at real world inventions, breakthroughs, on the level of word-shaking, and see who was behind most of them. One ethnic group is even known for trying to claim some who aren’t of their ilk, actually are of their own little group, just to try and enlarge their claims of “look what we did.”

          • FeuerSalamander

            he talks about IQ because he can not talk about achievement. The pointy heads in academia just can not wrap their heads around the fact that the modern world is the result of white people.

          • Chip Carver

            He talks about IQ to get your attention away from what’s going on the real world. This is why the trolls avoid any facts that are laid out in black and white.

            The other problem is middle aged men who are still in school, afraid of the real world, still going for their advanced degrees, and still gullible enough to swallow the trash tossed out their by the Red Diaper Grandbabies who make up a lot of the staff at our supposed institutes of higher learning.

          • FeuerSalamander

            HE is past middle age. HE claims he was at harvard in the 70’s listening to a famous speaker.

          • Strike_Team

            The trolls are a group effort. Best to ignore the bunch and their worn out Hasbara Playbook tactics. Broken record doesn’t begin to describe their lack of creativity. They ignore inconvenient facts while screeching the same selective material over and over and over.

        • JohnEngelman

          Where is your evidence of that assertion?

          I have frequently documented the opposite assertion, often using material I have found on American Renaissance.

          • LACountyRedneck

            Live cat-boiling.

          • JohnEngelman

            My diet is largely vegetarian. I have been troubled by killing animals for human consumption ever since I was a child when I saw an aunt kill a chicken on the farm my father grew up on.

            Nevertheless, Orientals consume less meat, fish and poultry than Americans. Most do not eat dogs and cats.

            It is also true that every year in the United States hundreds of thousands of dogs and cats are killed in dog pounds.

          • LACountyRedneck

            Eating a live animal, or cooking a live animal, is not quite the same. Whites enjoy fresh meat but it’s usually dead and cooked prior to consumption. I don’t quite understand one oriental choking a dog with a noose while the other electrocutes it prior to processing it in their restaurant. I can post the vid if you like.

          • JohnEngelman

            If it makes you feel better, I am strongly opposed to eating dogs and cats. When I eat at an Oriental restaurant I usually order tofu.

          • LACountyRedneck

            I never assumed you, John. I was referring to Orientals. I’ve seen many examples. Tofu is high in protein.

          • Anna Tree

            There is a controversy with soja’s estrogen and men consumption…

          • benvad

            Sounds like you’ve never been to the orient. It’s very common in many countries except Japan and amongst non muslims.

          • Einsatzgrenadier

            In Group Differences in Intelligence (2000), the psychologist and intelligence researcher John Loehlin writes:

            There is some dispute as to whether Asian Americans obtain higher average scores on IQ tests than European Americans or score at about the same level. Richard Lynn has estimated that the IQs of Asians in their native countries average around 106 but that those of Asian Americas might be a little lower (Lynn, 1991). In contrast, James Flynn has argued that many studies that have compared the test scores of various Asian-American samples with U.S. norms have involved an artifact, namely, they have failed to allow for the prevailing upward creep of IQ test performance over time (the so-called “Flynn effect”; Flynn 1984, 1996). When the results from studies using just Asian-American samples were adjusted for this effect and combined with those from studies in which both groups were simultaneously measured on the same tests, Flynn found little overall IQ difference between European and Asian Americans – perhaps a couple of IQ points in favor of European Americans (Flynn, 1991).

            […]

            There is also a large difference in how effectively Asian Americans and European Americans convert their cognitive skills into professional and occupational achievement (Weyl, 1969). Flynn estimated that Asian Americans tend to achieve at a level characteristic of European Americans with IQs 10 to 20 points
            higher. This is partly because a greater proportion of Asian Americans who are qualified for higher education in fact undertake it and partly due to their being able to succeed at lower ability levels by working harder (Flynn, 1991).

            According to the Coleman Report (1966), Oriental Americans have lower IQs than white Americans. When the report’s scores are expressed in an IQ metric, the average scores for groups of differing ancestry were:

            European
            Americans: Verbal: 102 Nonverbal: 102

            African
            Americans: Verbal: 85.5 Nonverbal: 85.9

            Asian
            Americans: Verbal: 98.2 Nonverbal: 101.5

            Native
            Americans: Verbal: 88.9 Nonverbal: 95.0

          • Kalashnikov

            I’ve often wondered if a large enough sample of the billions of Chinese could really be given an IQ test of any sort to be representative. Or are the tests given to those in the cities, or more likely to those that the CCP wants to take the test. Are the great masses of the interior as smart as the city dwellers?

          • FeuerSalamander

            No, only people in coastal cities are ever tested. As for the supposedly high IQ of Ashkenazi, these claims are made on only a couple of tests where a sample size of about 15 individuals was used. There has never been a TRUE measure of their group IQ either.

          • a multiracial individual

            Aren’t you the same person who just previously claimed that Mr. Engelman discusses IQ because he cannot discuss actual accomplishment? Must I point out there TANGIBLE accomplishments of Ashkenazi Jews?

          • JohnEngelman

            Ashkenazi Jews have the highest IQ of any ethnic group known. They average around 112-115, well above the European norm of 100…

            Their numbers among prominent scientists are roughly ten times greater than you’d expect from their share of the population in the United States and Europe. Over the past two generations they have won more than a quarter of all Nobel science prizes, although they make up less than one-six-hundredth of the world’s population. Although they represent less than 3 percent of the U.S. population they son 27 percent of the U.S. Nobel prizes in science…

            American Jews are also over represented in other areas, such as business (where they account for about a fifth of CEOs) and academia (where they make up about 22 percent of Ivy league students).

            – Gregory Cochran and Henry Harpending, from “The 10,000

            Year Explosion: How Civilization Accelerated Human Evolution,” Chapter 7: “Medieval Evolution: How the Ashkenazi Jews Got Their Smarts,” pages 188, 189, 190.

            http://www.amren.com/ar/2009/05/index.html

            http://the10000yearexplosion.com/

          • Geo1metric

            Why would you assume that “city dwellers” are smarter than country folk?

      • FeuerSalamander

        Hey john, hows that economic recovery you were talking about?Hmmm. economy slow close to ZERO, and yet, you say it is picking up. Guess you just don’t know what you are talking about, ever.

        • JohnEngelman

          The easy economic growth that followed World War II, and which returned during the Clinton administration, probably cannot be restored.

          Nevertheless, from the administrations of Warren G. Harding to that of Bill Clinton there was nearly always more economic growth under Democratic presidents than Republican presidents.

          http://www.singularity.com/charts/page99.html

          From the presidencies of Harry Truman to that of George W. Bush there were nearly always more jobs created per year under Democratic presidents than Republican presidents. More jobs were created yearly under Jimmy Carter than Ronald Reagan.

          http://blogs.wsj.com/economics/2009/01/09/bush-on-jobs-the-worst-track-record-on-record/

          Even this is true: “Since 1900, the Dow has averaged a 7.8% annual gain under Democratic presidents, compared with a 3% annual gain under Republicans.”
          http://blogs.wsj.com/marketbeat/2012/11/06/what-an-obama-win-may-mean-for-stocks/

          Under President Obama the unemployment rate is slowly declining, despite Republican obstruction.

          http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/data/UNRATE.txt

          About the only thing one can be sure of is that under Republican rule the rich will get richer. In a stagnant economy that can only happen when nearly everyone else gets poorer.

          • FeuerSalamander

            You were WRONG john, you can bring up all the qualifiers you want to try to make down up, backwards into forwards. None of it matters. the economy is continuing to tank, and that is the opposite of what you have claimed.

          • JohnEngelman

            Document your assertions like I do.

        • FeuerSalamander

          nope, no reply, the coward just like to hides behind his piles of dusty old books and throw stones. This is why he is detested on this site.

          • JohnEngelman

            I am detested by those who do not like for their prejudices to be disputed by facts I post and document. Many of those facts come from this website. My detractors have strong opinions, but weak minds.

      • Anna Tree

        Argh… your litany again.

        An honest race realist would acknowledge that ashekenazi Jews are whites and an honest person would acknowledge that IQ (in a certain high range anyway) is obviously less important than creativity and ingeniosity as obviously whites had/have more successful civilizations than North East Asians, moreover Orientals.

        Most achievements, in science, art, philosophy, human rights, discoveries, inventions would have not been without the white race. Not so for all the other races, included the NE Asians. Sorry.

      • Caucasoid88

        We realize that, you dork. What a broken record. High IQ doesn’t necessarily translate to creativity or morality. Those are two things Ashkenazi Jews and Orientals do not excel at. A lovely mixture of creativity, IQ, and morally conscious temperament — and yes, a large population in the early 20th century — is what led to Western Civilization dominating the world in terms of scientific, industrial and artistic might. That is the world I’d like to return to. I do not want to live in Hong Kong, and I do not want to live in a society maligned by parasitical influences.

        • FeuerSalamander

          Almost all of the technology that the white man changed the world with in the 19th-20th centuries was a reinvention of things that the ancient Greeks and Romans invented. The ancient greeks and Romans had pistons, look up the “hydraulus”. Heron invented the steam engine as well. They just never made the leap of combining the two. There was a gigantic ship called “The Syracusa” that foreshadowed ocean liners, it was dismantled only because there were no ports large enough for it at the time. There were cars on rails that ferried things across the isthmus of Corinth. They were just two steps away from building a steam locomotive at that point-combining the piston with steam power and putting that engine orb a rail car.The Gauls invented the mechanical reaper. Heron also created automatons, even creating what can be argued to be the worlds first computer in his totally automated mechanical play.Then there is the antykithera mechanism, which was a very sophisticated mechanism for calculating the position of the sun and moon and several planets when a date was entered. The romans also had a very accurate odometer. Leonardo DavVinci tried to recreate it but he failed as the shape of the teeth on his gears was wrong. It wasn’t until much later that Europeans recreated it.

          It seems white people have the ability to think in ways that other races do not, and that IQ tests are not a complete measurement of intelligence. It seems that a civilization built by whites can be destroyed, but whites will be able to rediscover and rebuild all of it over time. The accomplishments of the black race are non existent. the accomplishments of the yellow race pale in comparison, and many of them probably came from Europe , through trade,anyway.

          • Einsatzgrenadier

            The Chinese borrowed the horse-drawn chariot from Indo-European invaders.

      • wildfirexx

        John…you are starting to sound like a broken record!

        • JohnEngelman

          The broken record keeps repeating what is true, and what I document, frequently using material I have found on this website.

          • FeuerSalamander

            no, it keeps ignoring the truth, trying to drown it out, like a child with it’s fingers in it’ ears going “lalalalala”

          • JohnEngelman

            I document my factual assertions. You do not.

      • Medizin

        Others here have repeated the following, previously, but you continue to forget or choose to forget. Germans and Dutch have the same IQ’s as Ashkenazi Jews. English comparable to Orientals. If Orientals means Japanese.

      • Kalashnikov

        If Orientals really do have higher intelligence why didn’t they do anything with it? One of them apparently came up with gunpowder, somebody made some fireworks, and 2000 years later nothing further had been accomplished. With their sheer numbers there should have been mountains of genius to work with. They could have invented the modern world. But they didn’t. They did little or nothing of note for thousands of years. If they are smarter why was the modern world a European invention?

        • WR_the_realist

          Orientals do use their (slightly) higher average IQ. Look at any engineering course given in America today and you will see Asians in the classroom represented well out of proportion to their percentage of the population. Read contemporary papers in the natural sciences, mathematics, and advanced engineering (not the stuff written 50 or 100 years ago) and you will see lots of Asian names in the author lists.

          In my experience people who insist that Asians are unimaginative drones who just copy whites are not themselves currently working in science or mathematics.

    • Brian

      The width of the gaussian matters just as much as the mean, and while whites have a lower mean than orientals, we have a greater percentage above 140 IQ, which is where the progress comes from. The same result occurs in mathematical ability between men and women. Men dominate at the top and bottom of ability; women clump to the middle.

    • Luca

      I say forget IQ, It is a one-dimensional argument. IQ is only one piece of a very complex puzzle. Aside from IQ there are other qualities which are just as important, or more important, such as work ethic, drive, persistence, morality, group dynamics, risk taking, altruism, creativity, charity and civility to name but a few.

      What matters is which group of people were able to bring the world into enlightenment and modern times. Which group of people civilized the planet through technology and agriculture. etc. etc.

      Hint: It wasn’t Asians and it wasn’t Africans. Another hint: It was people with European DNA.

      And any Jewish cheerleaders out there, just remember this: without European DNA, Jews would be nothing more than non-Muslim Arabs.

      • Kel Knight

        Agree with this. IQ is one dimension; there are legions of individuals with high IQs who, due to other factors both external and internal, never contribute anything of value to society or manifest their full potential. As far as populations go, while Asians and Ashkenazis may objectively have higher IQ than Europeans, the history of humankind reveals the European as the overall optimal manifestation of our species.

    • HJ11

      Not all Whites are the same. The right Whites actually have higher intelligence than anyone else.

  • JohnEngelman

    Liberals like Stephen J. Gould use the theory of evolution as a weapon against Protest Fundamentalists. Then they ignore the evolutionary implications of individual and racial differences in behavior and performance.

    • Alexandra1973

      You mean Protestants?

  • RyanP

    I smell another Bell Curve style fire storm coming. This is going to be fun to watch. Eventually the general public is going to learn that these ideas come from intelligent people looking at actual evidence. It is not some conspiracy by bigots to corrupt science to support their irrational “hatred”. I bet most of the people that write about group differences squirm with discomfort at their findings and wish it wasn’t true.

    • JohnEngelman

      They cannot refute the assertions of race realism, so they try to silence those who propagate them.

  • JamesR

    Is there reliable information as to what translations will appear and when? Any chance it
    will surface in Russia?

  • ThomasER916

    Culture doesn’t necessarily “breed” the people as it does sustain the breed. The Greek culture of the ancient world couldn’t sustain the brilliant people that created it. There were problems within the culture that were not being addressed, much like Western Civilization today. The Italian Renaissance was a true rebirth as it allowed several autodydacts living at the same time and place to altruistically share their genius, which is uniquely White/Western trait. The best among us were able to draw from our best peoples – The Greeks and Romans. It was recently discovered that St. Basil’s Cathedral was decorated and tiled by Northern Italians. The problem right now is our geniuses, leaders, and plebes are anti-White, whether conscious or unconscious. They will scream “racism” at the most innocuous statements, choices, words, or even glances.

    Not having an explicitly White religion and pan-nationalist/tribal morality is much to blame. Such ideals would provide us refuge against this ethno-masochistic stupidity.

  • HJ11

    Sailer’s piece is less interesting and informative than Jared Taylor’s. I missed Taylor’s column the first time around, but clicked on the link above and was impressed.

  • David Ashton

    Some creationists argue the racial differences began with the alleged dispersal from Babel which makes the variation even more recent and therefore genetically improbable. Some would argue for a micro-evolution like the variation among domesticated animal breeds and/or an accelerated degeneration of some subspecies and/or a miraculous “curse” on hitherto united humanity as a result of its impudence. One would suppose that the Creator wants the races and nations to remain separate entities, and that seems in accord with other scriptural statements. The JW quotations from non-Christian UNESCO are of course “dated”. After every innocent human baby and nostril-breathing animal were drowned in the imaginary global deluge, the survivor Noah soon misbehaved himself, as did all the subsequent human beings who then had to be “saved” by the cruel death of God’s own “son”. It has all ceased to make sense to me, but then a local “friend” of Baptist persuasion tells me that God could have predestined me from eternity to be tortured for ever as an incorrigible skeptic.

    • Geo1metric

      “the Athanasian paradox that one is three, and three but one, is so incomprehensible to the human mind, that no candid man can say he has any idea of it, and how can he believe what presents no idea? He who thinks he does, only deceives himself. He proves, also, that man, once surrendering his reason, has no remaining guard against absurdities the most monstrous, and like a ship without a rudder, is the sport of every wind. With such persons, gullibility which they call faith, takes the helm from the hand of reason, and the mind becomes a wreck.” — Thomas Jefferson

  • FeuerSalamander

    Once again, you repeat the same rhetoric. The patents that the Japanese are filing in abundance are things like plastic mechanical crisp grabbers in the shape of an animal. There is a craze in Japan on getting rich by inventing the next fad item and their stores are filled with tons of these plastic pieces of entertaining, but not ground breaking items. Much of their patents that are more technical and more practical are nothing more than rehashing of , or slight alterations of things patented in the west decades ago.

    • JohnEngelman

      For over a generation the Japanese have manufactured better automobiles and consumer electronics than the United States.

      • FeuerSalamander

        They did not invent nor reinvent the auto nor consumer electronics. They finessed them a little perhaps, but nothing groundbreaking. They also built a submarine aircraft carrier in WWII, nothing groundbreaking, just more complications to an existing technology.They also do not have a negro work force. Nuff said.

        • JohnEngelman

          What matters is that Orientals have more creative potential than whites. Students in South Korea and Japan outperform students in all white countries in mathematics and science.

          http://siteselection.com/ssinsider/snapshot/sf011210.htm

          • benvad

            They don’t know what to do with it unless they get the groundbreaking ideas from America.

      • benvad

        I live in Japan, this country doesn’t have to deal with Unions such as the UAW and other mafia run crooked entities. When they have a strike, it’s just for a day.

        They have a great loyalty to countrymen, company & family. That’s why the were so successful in the 80s. Oh, one big important thing, their labor costs were minuscule compared to the big 3, GE & Westinghouse.

        Factor all of that and Reagan opening up the market to foreign competition and voilà!

  • FeuerSalamander

    Then why don’t they have a successful society? The Chinese have always had, and always will have a brutal monarchic system. Life for the vast majority of Chinese has always been brutal while a very small elite lived in extravagant luxury. This is still the case. I would hardly call Hong Kong a successful society when the living conditions are such that the average person lives in a personal space no larger than the average american bathroom.

    The Japanese have adopted a western style democracy and they are dying a rapid demographic death. There is a widespread phenomenon in Japan of asexuality amongst the young. WE have westernized them, and it is killing them. China is only benefitting from a demographic dividend built on the forced abortion of hundreds of millions. That is a strategy which has a built in limit which, when it is reached as is happening now, will have hugely negative repercussions.

  • FeuerSalamander

    I think what kept the numbers of africans down was other africans more than anything else.

  • Kel Knight

    The research of brilliant scientist Anatole Klyosov has also failed to make impact, similar to NYT Nicholas Wade’s reporting. Klyosov’s research demonstrates that Out Of Africa is predicated on data, much of which is dubious at best, debunked at worst, and outright assumptions, aka guesses as relates to “molecular clock” and explanation for high African genetic diversity and why it meant we’re all descended from Africans. Nutshell: molecular clock is product of guesstimated mutation rates that upon closer examination were not reliable or accurate (I believe even Wilson and Stoneking later backed off of this concept, although Cann stubbornly clings to it, it appears) and high genetic diversity could just as easily, and more likely, be the result of the fact that Africa was home to multitude of various populations that, over time, would result in high rates of genetic diversity in descendants. OOA authors made the assumption this genetic diversity indicated Africans were the oldest population, therefore the first people and all others were descended from them. As Klyosov rather snarkily but accurately points out: his brother is older than he but that does not mean he is descended from his brother. Klyosov is worth researching, please read his scholarly papers, even if some of jargon regarding genetics is a bit alien to layperson, the concepts contained therein are still quite clear to even non scientists. It is telltale that there is radio silence from scientific and academic community to Klyosov’s papers. He is widely known for his intellectual brilliance, his credentials and affiliations are impeccable, his research well supported, sound and convincing. But because the OOA brigade is loathe to examine even a faulty theory born from their sociopolitical agenda, and because Klyosov is difficult to impeach or refute, they remain quiet, hoping no one will notice their ridiculous theory is hanging by a thread at best.

  • Kel Knight

    I would also like to point out to those that buy the fantasy that homo sapiens evolved solely and completely in Africa before dispersing and or replacing all other populations, that there is no convincing, legitimate evidence that these contentions are true. The fossil remains found in Africa and categorized as homo sapiens suffer from two fatal flaws; they either possess robust, archaic traits atypical of what is referred to as anatomically modern humans or the remains are so fragmented and incomplete, it’s impossible to know if they are archaic or amh. That is the fossil record; the genetic record is similarly unclear and inaccurate in its conclusions, as I touched on in previous post. I am appalled by the frequency and righteousness with which headlines, laypeople, students and some scientists themselves repeatedly put forth Out of Africa (and even the thoroughly debunked Recent Out of Africa) as proved, factual, supported by irrefutable evidence. Nothing could be further from the truth but it demonstrates that when science is shaped or influenced by a sociopolitical agenda, accuracy and evidence are something between pliable and meaningless.

    • FeuerSalamander

      Recently an 800,000 year old HUMAN footprint fossil was found in the UK, things like this show up every now and then. Those who have their “theories” ignore or try to explain away such things. They can’t though. There is actually no REAL evidence at all for the current beliefs about the origin of humanity and the races. There is a lot of conjecture, that is all. I would say that the human race is likely vastly older than anyone thinks, and that the races were likely separate from the beginning.

      • JohnEngelman

        The human foot is the first distinctively human characteristic that evolved. Human foot print prints several million years old have been discovered in Africa.

        • Kel Knight

          Foot prints that appear to be from genus homo, correct? Please note such evidence does not support the theory that homo sapiens evolved solely and to amh status in Africa.

  • Anna Tree

    — First, Mr. Jared Taylor is not god. He can be wrong. You did an Appeal to Authority fallacy. Anyway, even if he was god (I wonder sometimes… just kidding… I think…) I don’t succumb to any blind faith. Please give a rational argument to your claim.

    — Second, I read the excellent article you linked to and your quote of Mr. Jared Taylor. The nuances are always important. Asians, obviously he means North-East Asians, may be superior in about any “ingredients” for a successful society, but clearly it is not enough, some “ingredients” have more importance than others and whites are superior in those “ingredients”. They maybe be superior in about any “ingredients”, but they don’t achieve the superior societies/civilizations, whites do.

    You can have a bunch of culinary chief, some may use better ingredients than others, nevertheless there will be a chief, who may not have the best ingredients, but still will cook the best soup. Guess what, the chief is white! In every class, the best chief is white!

    You should be proud, why aren’t you? It seems you are not, we don’t mind, but why you don’t want us to be proud?

    Anyway, I said litany because you always say that and many if not most Amreners agree that Asians have higher IQs. We don’t care if they do, we just want to have white nations like Asians have Asian nations. Racialism is not only to point at difference I think, it is also to claim that races do better separately. This is not white nationalism necessarily, although there is nothing bad about it. It is just common sense, comfort and peace.

    —Third, I will repeat that whites have the most successful societies. Most achievements, in science, art, philosophy, human rights, discoveries, inventions would have not been without the white race. Not so for all the other races, included the NE Asians.

    If you are an honest racialist, you should have no problem acknowledging this.

    I will help you, I acknowledge that NE Asians have higher IQs. Now your turn!

    • JohnEngelman

      The supremacy of the West is due to historical accidents that are losing their potency as I write.

      Orientals have the genetic potential to surpass us. Whether or not they will will depend largely on whether or not the dictatorial rulers of China have the sense to avoid war. China can achieve world hegemony by peaceful means.

      • Anna Tree

        Oh my, sure we had thousands of years of historical accidents! How many historical accidents do you need to understand that those are not accidents, that the supremacy of the West is just a fruit of the white race?!

        You do know that this is exactly what black and other non-whites say about our civilizations, right? That we did well because of this and that, and this and that.

        Excuses!!!

        And that they did bad because of this and that, and this and that.

        Excuses again!!!

        For example, you don’t want to acknowledge that our civilizations supremacy is due to our genetic potential, but you acknowledge that the Chinese genetic potential will make them surpass us!

        You cannot have your cake and eat it! What is good for the goose, is good for the gander!

        If China can achieve world hegemony because of their genes, then Europe had achieve world hegemony because of our genes.

        • WR_the_realist

          Well, actually in the year 1500 an objective observer of both China and Europe would have rated China as having the more advanced civilization. There was a big long gap between the height of Roman civilization and the Renaissance, and not a whole lot of advancement happened during that gap.

          • Anna Tree

            I beg to disagree but true that this is actually what we are told in schools, so I, like you, believed this, until I read a book that made me think and research more on that period before the Renaissance, and changed my mind:

            The Middle Age weren’t really dark ages, and show already an European hegemony. It is just the people living the Renaissance looked at the previous generations with a better-than-thee attitude.

            From Michael Crichton’s book Timeline:
            “We owe much to the Middle Age. Our present Western world is more the result of the Middle Ages than the Renaissance. The Renaissance gave us art and and freedoms but those were
            already won in the Middle Ages. The Middle Ages gave us the nation-states, the central government and urban life, the universities and the codes of law and ideas of justice, well also the government bureaucracies, and dozens of other institutions.

            They weren’t gloomy and stagnant, it was much an exciting time. A period of change, movement and travel. The English longbow ended the knights status in a few decades. New, more efficient methods of plowing, fertilizing and crop rotation revolutionalized the agricultural methods. The medieval social order was not fixed and many new enriched families found their way into the nobility. Women had no legal rights but they were prime players in what was happening and had the right to take care of the businesses and other family affairs like the defense of the castle against besieging armies. It was a time of terrible disease, but also of joy in life and appreciation of its preciousness maybe more than today.”

          • WR_the_realist

            I’m not saying that nothing good happened during the Middle Ages, but the fact is that the average peasant in 1450 wasn’t noticeably better off than the average peasant in 550. And the educated elites in 1450 didn’t understand much more about the natural world than they did at the time of the Romans. By 1500 hardly any of the advances of western civilization that white nationalists use to “prove” the superiority of Europeans over Asians had happened.

          • Anna Tree

            I still disagree. I brought support in my previous post to why. I could have bring more like reminding you of the Carolingian Renaissance during the Franks hegemony, notably the spread of education with the establishment of schools (for poor as well) during the reign of Charlemagne.
            See more: scholar.chem.nyu(dot)edu/tekpages/Timeline(dot)html
            earth-history(dot)com/Europe/medieval(dot)htm

            More, do you think a people suddenly go from being inventors of civilizations to stagnating in the Early Middle Ages (and back again to be the world hegemony) for no good reason? How about centuries of jihad (mass-killing, raping, pillaging, enslaving) against the Levant and the South Eastern European countries? The 1st Crusade was launched in 1096. Prior to that, Muslims conquered and killed Non-muslims in Syria 635, Palestine 638, Persia 642, Eqypt 642, (North Africa 642-698,) (Kabul 711, the Indus region/Samarkand 712) Spain 712, Toulouse 721, (Kyrgyzstan 751,) Armenia 1071.

            Muslim expansion into Europe was only stopped at Tours in 732.
            The Greeks held back the Muslim hordes from the first attacks in 734 up to 1453. In the 14th century Turkey conquered Bulgaria, Macedonia, Romania, Hungary and parts of Poland and Russia. Turkey was stopped only as it lay siege to Vienna in 1683.
            What we call the dark age of Europe is exactly the terrible consequence of islam incessant attacks and spreading its claws on all those Christian lands like Assyria, Egypt or the Zoroastrian Persians, blocking notably the exchange of
            ideas between the East and the West etc

            If it weren’t for the muslims, the works of Plato, Aristotle or of
            those Persians and Hindus mathematicians or scientists etc wouldn’t have been lost! It is the muslims who burned libraries and forbade anything that contradicted the koran, if it wasn’t for the muslims forcing islam on all those formerly Christian white lands (since then neither Christian nor white because of rape and later miscegenation of the forced converts with non-whites), all those books were going to Europe before islam without any problems.

            From RobertB
            unamusementpark(dot)com/2012/05/guest-post-what-good-are-white-men-anyway/#comment-23915

            “The Ancient Greeks, followed by the Romans, laid the groundwork–including science, for everything that exists in the modern world that is good. No one, other than Americans, with the invention of the iron girder, has ever surpassed Roman engineering skills–no one. To this day, the ancient dome of the Hagia Sophia remains one the world’s greatest engineering triumphs. Have you any comprehension of what it took to build such a vast, free standing dome? The MATH involved? The fact that, to this very day, we still build them that way? There is an even older one in Rome.”

            We will agree to disagree I presume…

  • JohnEngelman

    From various sources I have learned that Jews, Episcopalians, and Hindus are roughly comparable. East Indians have lower average IQ’s than Americans, but it is the best educated East Indians who move to the United States.

  • LACountyRedneck

    Not in Asia.

  • Truth Teller

    That first sentence turned me off. Asians point to 700,000 yr old Java man as a counter to the Out of Africa theory.

  • Truth Teller

    Hey there Engleman, Say It Loud, I’m White and I’m Proud. I am a White Nationalist and an anti everything but White racist. I am a racist and proud of it. i’m up in Atherton for a while. Let’s get together and exchange views.

    Get rid of Engleman.

  • Truth Teller

    The overwhelming cause of the so called Dark Ages was the Justinian Plague cerca 500 t0 600. Europe,middle east and N. Africa were de populated. That plague did not spread to Scandinavia, Russia or Arabia. That plague was the major reason the Muslims were able to invade S. Europe, middle east and N Africa so quickly. Same reasons the Vikings were so successful. Basically, there was not enough population to fight the invaders from the north and south.

    Cerca 600,the Pope sent one of the St Augustine’s to Briton so see basically if there was anyone left alive on the island. He found that the Britons had no memory of the Roman occupation. The ruins were all around, but the Britons thought those buildings had been created by giants and elves in the olden days. So many had died in the 200 years since the Romans left that there was no written or verbal memory.

    The plague is not well known because there were so few survivors to record it. That plague was the cause of both the “Dark Ages” and the successful muslim invasions.

  • Truth Teller

    Never been to China, Vietnam, Thailand, Korea, Cambodia, etc have you Englaman? I don’t mean tourist hotels with plumbing but living the way the average middle class, not poverty level peasant lives. I have a chinese friend, 40 yr old computer programmer. He tells me that in china they still have out houses. But unlike Europeans in and Americans in the old days, they never pour lie down the hole to dissolve the excrement. It just piles up and mountains of maggots cover it. He says that Chinese kids are afraid to go to the outhouses because of the maggots so they just drop trou all over the place.

  • Cambrian Smith

    I understand that perspective. But I also think it’s very rational to want to preserve majority status in your own nation or city. Any population who wants to commit collective suicide by ending its majority status is not sane.

    A large Chinese or Japanese *minority*? I’m happy about having that. But today the US has 4% Asian, so I’m not leaning on this to solve our diversity dilemmas. Do you think Asian populations think it’s wise to displace their own people with foreigners? They would tell you that’s suicidal thinking, I believe.

    • JohnEngelman

      White Gentiles, Jews, Orientals, and East Indians compete academically and economically, but we do not conflict violently. This is because we have been genetically tamed by several thousand years of civilization.

      The problems are caused by Negroes and Hispanics. These are closer in number of generations to a neolithic environment in which the best killers had the most children, and consequently the most sons who inherited violent abilities and proclivities of their fathers.

  • Truth Teller

    Here’s another suggestion for Engleman who claims to live in N California. If you want to see how asians really live in America, I suggest you go up to San Francisco and contract 10 or 15 real estate agents and look at about 100 houses for sale. They won’t allow a White person to look in Chinatown proper or the inner Richmond aka Chinatown West. If however,you look at 50 or so random houses for sale in San Francisco, you will see how the asians, especially chinese live.

    Check out Bayview, Sunset, Marina and outer Richmond. You will see the 4 or 5 room 1,000 sq ft house on top of a garage. You will notice that 20 or more people live in them. Check out the garage with bedspreads strung on ropes to divide it into sleeping areas. Check out several sets of bunk beds in every room.

    Go to Nob Hill, Russian Hill, North Beach and the older areas with the townhouses with 14 ft ceilings. You will see triple bunk beds to take advantage of the tall ceilings.

    Notice the chinese version of closets. They use S shaped hooks on the metal sides of the bunk beds with plastic grocery bags hanging from them filled with belongings. Walk along those streets and check out the houses with open garage doors. You will come across food processing operations in those garages, including chicken slaughter houses.

    I don’t know the truth of some of your nonsense Englemann, but I do know a lot about San Jose Santa Clara aka Silicon valley and how asians live in America, Engleman, and I do know your posts about San Jose and asians in America are out right lies.

  • Truth Teller

    Ever met a graduate of Bejing University or any other chinese university Engleman? obviously you haven’t, but I have met many because I worked at a major California university that seems to hire mostly People’s Republicans on long term H1B visas rather than more qualified Americans. The dorm rooms at Bejing and other chinese universities have 9 people on 3 triple tier bunks in rooms 9 ft long and 10 ft wide.

    Ever met anyone who actually lived in china? No you haven’t, neither a chinese person or someone who worked and lived in china. I do not know the truth of some of the c**p you post Engleman,but I know the truth about San Francisco asian housing, how middle class chinese live in china, chinese uni dorm rooms, and San Jose/SAnta Clara County Ca.

  • Truth Teller

    Here’s some European average IQs from the first site that came up on google.
    Italy, Austria, Germany 102 Norway Denmark 98 Poland Spain 99 Czech Republic 97
    and USA 98

    Note, Czech Republic is old Bohemia, people ethnic Germans Slovakia is Slavs.
    So much for the bigoted wanna be jew old testament protestant myth that S. Europeans are stupid papists. I think Americans who have never traveled much confuse Poles and Italians with the very low class peasants to capitalists brought over here as low paid immigrant labor.

  • Truth Teller

    How can anyone claim that blacks and hispanics are socially conservative when they have the lowest rates of marriage and the highest rates of abortion, illegitimate children and teen age unmarried pregnancies as well as the highest rates of domestic violence, children in foster homes and reform schools and the highest rates of crime, drug addiction and alcohol addiction? Have Hannity and O’Reilly etc ever listened to black music or watched black movies or TV?

    That’s Bill O’Reilly Sean Hannity republicanism, wishful thinking, head in the sand refusal to admit to reality.

  • Truth Teller

    Now Engleman claims his aunt killed a chicken. How was that done Engleman? you don’t know because that is another lie. I doubt any American Jewish woman has killed a chicken since colonial times and even then they had sabbath goys to do it. As a matter of fact Engleman, children absolutely love seeing chickens killed. I grew up on 7 acres in Marin county. My Mom had a little house o the prairie back to the land hippie complex plus 5 kids we needed a lot of food. We had a huge freezer with drawers. About every 6 weeks we went to Petaluma to buy chickens. The farmer chopped their heads off on his chopping block, an old tree trunk, we kids caught them and brought them to the farmer’s wife and teen kids who plucked, gutted and packed them.

    Seeing chickens killed is the most fun ever. After the head is chopped off, the farmer throws it into the mud. The chicken runs around for a long time flapping the wings and it is just so much fun to chase it around, capture it and bring it to be plucked, gutted and packed. You never gutted and packed out a deer either did you Englemann?

    I bet that story about the chicken killing aunt is just another Engleman lie. I doubt there is a child in the world who doesn’t enjoy catching dead chickens running around wings flapping wildly. It is so much fun it could be one of those birthday party games.

    • JohnEngelman

      I do not lie.

      I am confident that you are not lying when you say that you love to see chickens killed.

  • Truth Teller

    Feursalamander
    I thought he was a computer programmer in San Jose Ca during the 1970’s. He has posted hundreds of times of walking home at 10 pm along a street of vietnamese restaurants and never being mugged by the restaurant staff and customers during the 1970’s Of course he also claimed that during the 1970’s San Jose was a crime ridden black slum like Oakland during the 1970’s when most of the San Jose blacks were students at the local college, not residents of San Jose.

  • Truth Teller

    Someone mentioned St Basil’s cathederal. Italian builders were renowned all over the world. Isifan, the shi Persia religious headquarters city, a sort of Shi vatican is a glorious city of mosques and other buildings, lots of aqua and blue tile, built by italians. The grand mosque in Istanbul? italians again, many of them slaves. The Alhambra touted by ignorant anti christian bigots as an example of islamic building? Every inch built by Christian, mostly Italian slaves from engineers to lumpers. The united states capitol? Interior built by italians. All those glorious east of the Mississippi Missouri 19th century state capitols and county court houses? Many built by Italians, especially the interiors. Most of 17th, 18th and 19th century St. Petersburg and Moscow? Italians. Many of those glorious stately homes in England cerca 1400 to 1900? Built by Italians.

  • Fr. John+

    Whites did not come ‘out of Africa.’ Perhaps the Tarim Basin, but I have no connection to what amounts to a basically clothed Bonobo monkey, tyvm.