‘Cinco De Mayo’ Plenty of Beer, Little History

Russell Contreras, Associated Press, May 4, 2012

Here’s what Cinco de Mayo has become in the U.S.: a celebration of all things Mexican, from mariachi music to sombreros, marked by schools, politicians and companies selling everything from beans to beer.

And here’s what Cinco de Mayo is not, despite all the signs in bar windows inviting revelers to drink: It’s not Mexico’s Independence Day, and it’s barely marked in Mexico, except in the state of Puebla, where the holiday is rooted in a complicated and short-lived 1862 military victory over the French.

{snip}

The holiday has spread from the American Southwest, even though most are unaware of its original ties to the U.S. Civil War, abolition and promotion of civil rights for blacks.

Often mistaken for Mexican Independence Day (that’s Sept. 16), Cinco de Mayo commemorates the 1862 Battle of Puebla between the victorious ragtag army of largely Mexican Indian soldiers against the invading French forces of Napoleon III. Mexican Americans, during the Chicano Movement of the 1970s, adopted the holiday for its David vs. Goliath storyline as motivation for civil rights struggles in Texas and California.

Over the years, the holiday has been adopted by beer companies as a way to penetrate the growing Latino market, even as the historical origins of the holiday remain largely forgotten.

David Hayes-Bautista, a professor of medicine and health services at UCLA and author of the newly released “El Cinco de Mayo: An American Tradition,” said the holiday’s history in the U.S. goes back to the Gold Rush when thousands of immigrants from Mexico, Central and South America came to California during the Civil War.

According to Spanish-language newspapers at the time, this first group of multinational Latinos on U.S. soil identified with the Union Army’s fight against the Confederacy and often wrote pieces about the evils of slavery. Hayes-Bautista said these Latino immigrants were concerned about the Union’s lack of progress and Napoleon III’s interests in helping the South.

“It wasn’t until the news came about the Battle of Puebla that they got the good news they wanted,” said Hayes-Bautista. “Since Napoleon III was linked to the Confederacy, they saw the victory as the first sign that their side could win.”

They didn’t, of course, at least not for a few years. French forces took over Mexico after the Battle of Puebla, and installed Habsburg Archduke Maximilian as Emperor of Mexico. He was captured by Mexican forces five years later and put to death.

But in the years that followed, Latinos in California and the U.S. Northwest celebrated Cinco de Mayo with parades of people dressed in Civil War uniforms and gave speeches about the significance of the Battle of Puebla in the larger struggle for abolition, said Hayes-Bautista.

The Cinco de Mayo-Civil War link remained until the Mexican Revolution, which sparked another wave of Mexican immigration to the U.S. Those immigrants had no connection to Cinco de Mayo—except that U.S. Latinos celebrated it.

“That’s when it became about David vs. Goliath, Indians beating a European force, and it took on a new meaning,” said Hayes-Bautista. “The Civil War ties disappeared.”

{snip}

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  • CDM has become like St. Patrick’s Day and Mardi Gras:  Excuses to drink.  To the extent that people care about the real meaning of those days, they were/are far more important to the Mexican/Irish/French Catholic diaspora rather than the kinfolk back in the old countries.

    • Formerly_Known_as_Whiteplight

       When it comes to Mardi Gras, that’s not really true.  There are pre-lent festivals in some parts of Europe, in the traditionally Catholic countries.  St. Brigid’s Day is Feburary 2nd, also known as Candlemass as it was originally a Celtic Goddess named Brigid (Brighyd), and a festival of light during the last part of winter.   Also, in Spain, the entire Month of May is a festival.  People party every day (night) into the wee hours.

      • geraldmartin

        Ditto in Deutschland: It’s Karneval in some places, Fasching in others – strongest in Catholic areas but the Protestant areas have it too. Quite ridiculous behavior (ah, the memories).

  • No

    Reminds me of kwanzaa.  Non-whites have lots of these made-up holidays and made-up heroes. 

    White Santa brings lots of toys and happines.  Black satan breaks into your house and robs you.  So . . . here comes kwanzaa.  Yeah, let’s be proud . . .

    They see the white man proudly celebrating the Nation’s Birday and naturally the negro also wants a birfday.  So out come “Juneteenth.”

    Whites celebrate dozens of heroes known collectively as the “Founding Fathers.”  The negro doesn’t know his father . . . he’s really not sure what duties men have other than to donate sperm.  So out comes Reverend Michael King . . . who, naturally was a womanizer and whore-chaser..

    Whites celebrate hundreds of accomplishments.  The poor negro scratches his head . . . and celebrates the “invention” of peanut butter.

    Whites trace a proud lineage to Europe.  What do blacks have, lions and zebras?  So . . . suddenly blacks are ‘gyptians who built the pyramids. 

    Mestizos are doing the same thing.  They have n heroes, nothing to celebrate, no nation . . . so a made-up beer drinking holiday is better than nothing.

    • MikeofAges

      I can tell, you’re not 25 years old. Neither am I. I’m old enough to understand the beer-cerveza delusion. But I was once under the spell. Those beer companies. Their marketing is something. If they could figure out a way to turn Christmas into a beer holiday, they’d do it. Or Kwanzaa. Or anything.

      St Patrick’s Day is one their marketing coups. Shamelessly playing on the idea of the Irish as alcoholics. The height of their marketing, however, is simply the fact of convincing everybody under the age of about 28 that if they don’t know what they’re supposed to be doing at any given time, they’re supposed to be drinking beer. Anheuser-Busch is the lead offender. The purpose of their marketing is exactly that — convince all post adolescents and young adults that they should be drinking beer at all times. Oh, and it should be a Bud. But that’s secondary. They know they’ll get their market share.

      JSYK, PB was invented by a white physician. G.W. Carver did have some real accomplishments. Inventing PB was not among them.

      • No

        I’ve heard that about peanut butter.  There was a great site where they debunked all the black invention myths.  (Not sure if it’s still around.)  Basically, it appears like if any black ever tinkered with something . . . he gets credit for its invention.  The one that sticks out was the traffic signal.  Blacks get credit for inventing it.   But the actual model the black designed involved a bunch of swinging arms like an old-fashioned rail signal.  It had nothing to do with the model we all know.  Doesn’t matter.  Blacks get credit.

        Whenever blacks are involved you can expect massive corruption of truth.  There’s no other way to celebrate anything they did except to lie about it.

        • Formerly_Known_as_Whiteplight

           I’d be interested to know more about that claim to inventing the arm swinging traffic signal.  The early automobiles in Europe had mechanical left/right signals that actually lifted a lever with a hand and finger pointing.

          • MikeofAges

            Apparently happened. Blacks were involved in some early developments in applied technology. Why not?

            Allegedly, some black tinkerer had a role in developing the automatic transmission. If so, a lot of white guys owe their crooked living to him.

          • MikeofAges

            Ken wrote:

            “Automatic
            Transmission/GearshiftRichard Spikes in 1932? No!The first
            automatic-transmission automobile to enter the market was designed by
            the Sturtevant brothers of Massachusetts in 1904.”

            Just trying to spread around some sarcasm. the development of the automatic transmission took decades. There were not fully reliable units developed until the late 1950s. I am sure many hands were involved before the the concept was perfected.

          • Formerly_Known_as_Whiteplight

             I think it’s a case of what someone else posted on this thread; many blacks were taken in by do-good whites and taught things back in the era when ex-abolitionists were wont to become crusaders for black education, etc., with one group founding the NAACP for them and other started all black colleges.   Apprenticeships were no doubt part of this, so where they were involved, it becomes a claim for a sole black invention, even though the black involvement was minimal.

          • Bon, From the Land of Babble

            You’ll find it here:

            http://www33.brinkster.com/iiiii/inventions/

            A very useful list, n’est pas?  Add it to your arsenal and keep it handy, I use it all the time when debating arrogant blacks.

            Bon

    • Most people blind themselves to the reality of race, seeing things that aren’t there, and not seeing what it.

      What do you call someone who can’t see?

      A Notsee
       

  • KevinPhillipsBong

    Last year I worked with a few Hispanics and had to tell them what the May 5th holiday commemorated. They were interested for a few minutes and then began to get irritated that a white guy was instructing them as to their own traditions. They didn’t let me forget that – at least for a day or two.

  • sbuffalonative

    This ‘holiday’ only caught on once it was picked up by beer companies when they jump on the Hispanic bandwagon. It’s just another means for beer companies to promote their products and give (white) people a reason to drink to excess.

    Cinco De Mayo, artificial as it may be, has become a drinking holiday for whites. I’ve never known blacks or Hispanics to ‘celebrate’ this Mexican ‘holiday’ by drinking to excess. Whites are the only ones I’ve seen who

    • Formerly_Known_as_Whiteplight

      It has taken over in America as the once and still sometimes (in places) European celebration of May 1 as the real May Day, a time of celebrating when summer was considered to have begun, at least in the agricultural sense.  It was a celebration of fertility and some places in Europe from Sweden, to Ireland, Scotland, England, to Eastern European towns in some regions still celebrate it that way.  Our loss of our own cultural memory is largely due to Christianity, which only took over Easter, (a Spring festival where Eoster, a fertility goddess was honored and the March Hare and egg symbolized).  When we devolve into cultural blankness, a purely political holiday like Cinco de Mayo can easily usurp the natural urge to celebrate the arrival of brighter and more productive days, as well as having survived the winter, which was once a real concern to Europeans.

      •  Can you direct me to an appropriate fertility worshipping European religion?

        I would like to spread this in the USA.  

        Thanks.

        • Formerly_Known_as_Whiteplight

           Well, there are others already doing it since at least the 1970s.  It would probably be a better idea for you to join one and do a lot of self educating before taking it upon yourself to spread something if you haven’t already spent years studying and giving yourself time to create a feeling for it in yourself.  Otherwise, like many other religious/spiritual conversions, it is most superficial and also often a reaction to past experiences.  It takes a while to willow out that and the Christian brainwashing and (again) your reaction to it while learning about your real spiritual roots as a genetic European.

          I will tell you this much;  The North American Folk Assembly has existed since 1972 and as a survivor is probably the best choice.  Asatru (as it is called) is a combination of Nordic and Celtic spirituality.  It’s less of a religion than a way to be what you are at the core.  The important thing, and what I really like about it as a race realist, is that it makes ancestors important and therefore your own choices for your own “family planning” based on the love of them and your people.  This as opposed to a pointed anti-other strategy succeeds in asserting white, European identity without the need to fight with non-whites over the usual issues.  This also makes it more difficult for groups like the SPLC, the NAACP, or others to assail it.  I am thoroughly convinced (and can make a good debate for it) that Asatru is by far the best spiritual option for whites as it has none of the many pitfalls that other religions, especially Christianity poses for whites who wish to see their race survive.

  • ageofknowledge

    While Europeans became Americans, Mexicans well… you can see for yourself. Check this out: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/05/06/california-students-sent-home-wearing-flags-cinco-mayo/

    • This is insanity.

      • How can people not see this insanity?

        I think most Americans are a bunch of Not Sees.  That is our problem.
         

  • Diamond_Lil

    It’s a day to wear your American Flag T-shirt.

  • Well on Saturday when I go to meet my friends for our weekly beer at the local pub I will be wearing my ball cap that says “Remember the Alamo”

  • xxxtonygunsxxx

     The heads from the decapitated bodies were found in ice boxes outside the city
    hall, according to local security forces, only a mile from the American
    border.
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/centralamericaandthecaribbean/mexico/9247447/14-headless-bodies-found-in-Mexican-city.html

    • IstvanIN

      At least they had them on ice.

    • ageofknowledge
      •  That graphic is very incomplete, in that it does NOT show the overlay into the United States that surely does exist.

        • ageofknowledge

          That is correct Rocky. U.S. gangs are linking up with Mexican cartels and accepting retainers to “put in work” for them here on U.S. soil.

          There have been deaths on both sides of the border and the press has reported that Cartel leader’s wives have given birth here on U.S. soil which makes their children U.S. citizens.

          The Cardinal of Mexico (the top Catholic Church representative in Mexico) was even assassinated by San Diego streetgang members seeking to complete a hit for a Mexican cartel a few years ago. 

          A recent report from the FBI shows US street gangs growing closer with Mexican Cartels:

          http://www.fbi.gov/stats-services/publications/2011-national-gang-threat-assessment

          Yet American high school kids are sent home if they weat an American flag t-shirt to school on a Mexican holiday now in places like California and the courts have ruled against those kids.

      •  It’s like a bunch of Indian tribes……… All over again.

  • SintiriNikos

    So even the Mexicans beat the French?

  • Some may feel this Cinco to be a political provocation, but for most Americans this “event” is about booze. Add some tequila, please.

  •  Mexicans do drink a lot, but Blacks- they cannot hold liquor well.
    Of course, Whites- except the Jews- drink the most of all.

  • Formerly_Known_as_Whiteplight

    There is a CNN article online today that uses this book and author to make the claim that Cinco de Mayo is as America as the Fourth of July.

    In my life growing up and studying in California, and even taking a class on Mexican history in 1977 at a local JC, I never heard any mention of this holiday in California or AT ALL.  Further, I knew Mexican kids all through school and I never heard one of them get excited or say anything on May 5th or ever about this day.  I don’t doubt that it existed, somewhere, but these historical claims need references.

    Also, during the California Gold Rush, Mexican claims were taken over by Americans and the Mexicans often driven out of the areas completely.  The bandit San Joaquin Marietta was a robber whose aims were revenge for these actions by white, American miners and citizens in general.  They were not times of happy celebration of diversity as this article pretends.  Since the Mexican communities were under fire and not considered legitimate Americans, it throws the existence of Spanish language newspapers into question.  I never ever heard of a reference to one existing in the 19th century, and I grew up in Sacramento County.  My impression also has always been that the Mexicans who remained in California were not political people and literacy had to be rare.  This article pretends to say that Mexicans in California (or even Mexico) during this period were educated as a rule!

    I question the entire thing as a new high in modern political hyperbole and history revisionism.

    • Formerly_Known_as_Whiteplight

       I have a fairly rare historical resource in the form of a book published in 1954, as the culmination of years of research by a Californian historian.  The book is called, “The Early Inns of California.”  That may seem to be a dismal title promising a weary text about the stocking of pillows and laundry lists, but I assure you, it is chalk full of historical reference and antidotes and actually very informative and entertaining reading.  So I am posting this for the information that a few readers may appreciate as it may provide some insights into this article’s political validity and the notion of Cinco de Mayo in general.

      As California was during its time as part of Spain a quiet, rather laconic colony of ranches and vineyards where Indians were enslaved and converted – if they lived long enough, the few landowners there had land grants that extended so far in every direction that it was impossible for the owner to ever hope to run any real “rounds” let alone manage or “police” the territory of the typical Spanish land grant.  They had no racial or nationalist type problem with non-Spanish citizen entry and so when Captain John Sutter arrived from Switzerland with a plan to create an American colony, they didn’t run him off, but gave him such a land grant, which is represented somewhat today by the bounds of Sacramento County.  He was instrumental in helping establishing what eventually became the U.S. State of California.  More to the point;  When California became a Mexican possession as Mexico became independent of Spain, the transition was a political one.  No battles against Spain were ever fought in California.  Later on, the Mexican government enacted what was called the secularization of the missions. 

      In California the mission system was unique.  They were the place of social and political power.  Before an American owned and run hotel in Monterey, the place where the few travelers that did move along the little trail called “El Camino Real” found shelter at the sumptuous missions, or else made do at little stop overs called “ramadas” which were little more than rude sheds, where the traveler might compete with farm animals for sleeping quarters and were provided meals by the very hospitable nature of the Californios (as the Spanish settlers came to be called).  After the transition to Mexican administration, political power was still exerted through the padres at the missions and this was seen to compete with the “new order,” so the order went out.  The missions were put out of business fairly quickly.  Quick enough for the first hotel in Monterrey to be built with materials from the mission there.  The plan was that they would be taken over by the citizens who were properly approved of by the governor, who in this case was none other than the famous General Vallejo in the town of Sonoma, just north of San Francisco.

      But what is really interesting is the following;  A couple of Mexico City political “scaliwags” known for being less than ethical hatched plan to takeover California by moving in on the missions through gaining patents on them from Vallejo through force of arms.  They recruited 400 Mexican “citizens” and made their way to Sonoma.  Vallejo already had plans in place for the missions and was allied with an American attorney. Together they saw to an outcome that was favorable to eventual American ownership of form Spanish grant lands and the continuation of the missions as religious institutions in some cases, but with no political power.  The invaders were captured and one of the two leaders actually deported back to Mexico City, while the other survived to be a help but also a thorn in the side for General Vallejo.  He was a help because he had informed on his groups plan and so helped bring about its failure.  The “colonists” were kept prisoners for a time and then released with many going back to Mexico and only a few remaining.  It must be understood that at that time, Sonoma was so small that a grist mill that an American had built had been idle for some time because – get this; “There were no Americanos to run it.”  So the citizens there were grinding their corn and wheat in their own kitchens using stone bowls and pistils.

       This is the only story of an actual Mexican colonization plan during the 20 years that California was a Mexican possession.  During the Spanish control, no colonization plan was made and instead, local Indians were first enslaved and then later made into the “peons” joined by an occasional actual Mexican from around Vera Cruz or Mexico City as part of a settling entourage, and very occasionally joined by a more local border Mexicans.  Pilgrims journeying from central Mexico (Mexico City) were just as often set upon by Indian bands as were American settlers later on when they were arriving across the Western Plains and deserts.  Maybe worse because many considered the overland journey through Mexico prohibitive, making arrival by ship on the coasts safer and far more comfortable.  That is one of the evidences that no great Mexican colonization occurred before Captain Sutter  set his American colony plan into motion.  It was Sutter who bought Fort Ross from the Russians and moved the valuable items, such as the cannon, to his colony of New Helvetia on the Sacramento River.  From this Vallejo became convinced that the future of California would be best under the rule of the U.S. and issued passports to all new American arrivals.  (When the Bear Flag Revolt occurred in Sonoma, he opened his doors and wined and dined the revolutionaries.  When California became a state, Vallejo showed his allegiance to the U.S. by burning his Mexican uniform).

      On newspapers; the book contains no mention of Spanish language newspapers.  It also does not mention the existence of any Chinese, or Italian, or German, or any other non-English language newspapers during the period in question.  They may have existed and there is some reason to think that more Spanish speakers than I originally thought were literate, but not many more.  Some or all of the non-English speaking immigrants that began to arrive after 1843 and the flood of 1849 may have had some sort of public notification that may have resembled a community “newsletter” in some places, but English was the language to learn at least some of back then.  General Vallejo apparently knew enough to deal with his American Lawyer ally (who also may have spoke Spanish), but he also had to speak with the Russians who had a fur trading establishment on the Sonoma coast at Bodega Bay and Fort Ross.  The book does mention two newspapers; The California Star and The California Alta, both English language newspapers from that period.

       The book makes no mention of Cinco de Mayo, but that may be because it was too off topic.  However, the Fourth of July is mentioned and it was celebrated with gusto.  Also, when California was annexed as a state, the celebration was thunderous in San Francisco, with American flags, noises of all sorts, guns going off, fireworks, cannons firing.  There were no dissenting parties present and everyone, including apparently, General Vallejo seemed to welcome it.  He lived on in grand style in the state all his life .

      The other item to note;  There was little interest in gold finding for either the Californios or Mexicans.  Mexicans in Mexico have no doubt been aware of the Aztec gold that Cortez took after his conquest, yet no attempt was ever made by any notable Mexican to harvest gold in Mexico.  This is well illustrated in the classic film, “Treasure of the Sierra Madre” wherein the Mexican bandits who kill Bogie have no idea what gold is, they are just after their guns.  I have found locations of a couple mines in the California Sierras called “Spanish Mine,” but I don’t know if they existed during Spanish times or were the rare Mexican claims.  That there were some Mexican miners is certain, that they were many is not factual.  Most Spanish speakers in California in the 19th century were either wealthy holdovers from Californio families (who looked down onn Mexicans)  or poorer Spanish speakers who worked on ranches and farms.  The point is that they were never high in number, may or may not have had a public press, but of no major consequence, and certainly not revolutionary or likely to be concerned with what would have been far away events in Mexico during the revolt against the French empire’s period of incursion.  (Also good to note that Mexico City would be a hovel of huts today if Maximillian had not created the beautiful capital that he built it into, with Hapsburg money).

      This post is meant for the more curious among the readership who might like some deeper historical notes.

  • ageofknowledge

    That may be anon because so many simply drink every day.

  • Dunnyveg

    “According to Spanish-language newspapers at the time, this first group
    of multinational Latinos on U.S. soil identified with the Union Army’s
    fight against the Confederacy and often wrote pieces about the evils of
    slavery.”

    It’s a shame these Mexicans weren’t more interested in the evils of peonage, which resembled Americans slavery in many ways, and wasn’t stopped until the (Mexican) civil war of a hundred years ago. This war not only ended the Porfiriato, but ended the system of big haciendas.

    Then, hypocrisy has become a virtue for the modern left.

  • Just a “holiday” invented by alcohol companies to push sales and glommed onto by Mexican supremacists/reconquista types to compete against the 4th of July.

  • Bon, From the Land of Babble

    “Welcome to Cinco de Cuatro –Cinco de Mayo at the White House!”

    — President 0bama, 2009, in a lame attempt to note they were celebrating on the fourth of May instead of the fifth.

    Cinco de Cuarto means “five of four” in Spanish.

    Important May 5th  Dates In History:

    1818 – Karl Marx’s Birthday

    1862 – Victory Over The French Colonialist Army By Mexican Peasants

    2012 – Obama Launches Campaign

    Today, 0bama, America’s first Marxist president,  officially launches his 2012 re-election campaign on The Father of Communism’s Birthday, Cinco de Mayo! 

    0bama said America was the greatest country on the earth and he was going to change that.  Why is anyone upset?

    Bon

  • steve1red

    Hispanics and alcohol don’t mix.  They’re the worst group when it comes to handling alcohol.  They become obnoxious and it can get violent quickly.  I would avoid any cinco de mayo gatherings like the plague.  I’ve seen them when they’re drunk plenty of times and it isn’t a pleasant sight.

    • It depends on the type of booze. The worst drunks are pure Indians, Native Americans.
      Blacks are also poor drinkers.

      In Europe, northern peoples, especially Scandinavians, are atrocious- for instance Finns & their “excursions” in St. Petersburg. That’s why some of these countries have a partial prohibition – one gets depressed in a climate like that. Poles & Russians- pure horror.

      • Token Finn

        Finns are not really Scandinavians in a real sense and were not considered as such by true Scandinavians earlier in the day. The inclusion of Finland in Scandinavia, “Norden” is largely a political construct (of the sort for which Estonia also vaguely shoots for) which involves self-loathing politicians kissing up to Sweden and fellow states; the true Scandinavians are generally quite ignorant of Finland and the reporting is quite one sided with Finnish media reporting on Scandinavia but not the other way around. I think you referred to Norwegians as being tall ‘slaves’ earlier so I think you might want to reserve some judgement. Which is not to say that I don’t like fooling myself.

        •  I know who you are- cousins of my neighbors, Magyars. And I never said that Norwegians were “slaves”- this is ridiculous.

  • xxxtonygunsxxx

     
    http://www.newson6.com/global/story.asp?s=18148289

    I believe Daddy would still be with us if he
    hadn’t killed mom,” Andra said. “He broke daddy’s jaw so he couldn’t
    eat, broke his ribs so he couldn’t get up and move around. We did get
    him up to watch the Braves game, but he even lost that joy.”
    They hate their mother’s last moments on earth
    were filled with terror and their father’s with sorrow but take comfort
    in the memories and legacy the couple leaves behind.

    Nancy was known for her gracious hospitality,
    homemade jams and quilts. Bob was known for his woodworking talents,
    making airplanes and cabinets for his kids and grandkids.

    “He’s asleep,” Andra said. “No more pain, no more
    sorrow for his part. It’s what he wanted. He wanted to be where mom was
    and he’ll be buried with mama.”

    • It’s better that way. For those who are not believers- he simply ceased to be, like 110 + billion humans before him. For believers- he’s reunited with his wife.

  • IKantunderstand

    I don’t know what they teach  in “Hispanic Studies” ; I mean I assume there’s some such worthless piece of crap degree. I know for a fact that the fifth day of May in Mexico is no big deal. What it means in America is large groups of Whites(Gringos) getting drunk and celebrating their own demise. Party on, clueless Gringos, enjoy your Spanish as a second language course.And, relish your humble pie for the final (dessert) course.

    • http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Latino_studies

      http://www.brown.edu/Departments/Hispanic_Studies/

      It looks like this is a study of literature & culture of Spanish America.  I wouldn’t agree that this is a worthless study- after all, Spanish language lit. is among 3 greatest imaginative literaturs of the West in the 20th century (along with English and German, and surpassing French and Russian).

      Cinco has nothing to do with that, it’s a booze fest.

      • ageofknowledge

        The Spanish language doesn’t even begin to approach the degree of sophistication English offers. I’ve studied both. I know. English is the most advanced and beneficial language on earth.

        • Well, this is hardly a contention that a linguist would assent to.
          I know- beside English- Croatian, Russian & German, plus a smattering of Latin and Greek, and English is far from being the most sophisticated – especially in philosophical or intellectual vocabulary & syntax. It doesn not mean that it cannot express everything a civilized person need to know, but:

          a) Norman conquest has so altered English language that it has lost continuity with the Germanic past, which is most evident in word-formation that is still very “natural” in Romance languages- French, Spanish, Italian,..- not to speak of Slavic languages
           
          b) to say that language of Luis Gongora, Cervantes or Juan de la Cruz is unsophisticated one is…. not realistic statement.

          That said, every human language has strengths & weaknesses re various fields, from phonetics via phonology, morphology, syntax & stylistics. My fave is ancient Greek, but all developed modern languages are capable of expressing absolutely everything in the canon of Western civilization, from Plato to Proust.

        • ed91

          get your head out of the pumpkin!

    • ageofknowledge
  • When do The Mex start celebrating Cinco de Fast n’ FURIOSO?

  • http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_alcohol_consumption

    I won’t elaborate on an essentially marginal issue …

  • I tend to snarl at anyone to makes the mistake of wishing me a “Happy Cinco de mayo”.

    I’ve said it before: the celebration of a foreign political holiday has no place in the US.

  • Major

    Ahhhhh….the modern black “family”…..spread your wings, feed me and it’s all your fault…Judge.

    http://tinyurl.com/7hme4dp

  • ageofknowledge

    I don’t think it is well said. Modern English is the language of choice today for business, science, etc… the world over. So what if Latin and Greek majorly influenced it. Using your logic, one could argue that Japanese is better than English because they adopt so many English words by putting a san at the end of them. Modern english adopted the best of Latin and Greek and superceded them with a rich vocabulary that easily surpasses a quarter of a million distinct English words (with Oxford English Dictionary asserting that number excludes inflections and words from technical and regional vocabulary not covered by the OED is over three quarters of a million) as it evolved into the language of choice for getting sophisticated work done the world over. 

    When was the last time someone invoked pure Latin to communicate a new IEEE technology in an RFD or to write a technical white paper or as a business plan? Lol…

    And French is a rigid language, partly because of its institutionalization with the french academy, that simply doesn’t move fast enough.

    Spanish… a simplistic gutteral language used by jefes to manage illegals… at least where I live. I’ll stick with modern English. It’s serving me very well.

  • bluffcreek1967

    Oh great, another excuse for Mexicans to drink! Most of the larger city police agencies were on full alert and made many arrests of Mexicans for public drunkeness, DUI and fighting over the weekend. Isn’t it just wonderful what fine people we have allowed into our country?!

  • ageofknowledge
    ———————————-

    My God… try to learn something about languages, please. English has become after WW2 the most prominent language of science, sports, communication, politics etc.- no one disputes this. But, other languages had been fulfilling these functions during various stages of the past (Greek, Aramaic, Arabic, Chinese, Latin, French,..). Nowadays, if any language becomes the truly universal one, it could be Esperanto or something similar, not a living tongue. Possibility of increased language-learning potency is still a sci-fi area- I think it would be wonderful if an average child could learn 5 languages as easily as elementary mathematics, but contemporary homo sapiens just cannot do this ( research into brain chemistry & neuro-science should be necessary).

    As for English vs other languages- this is absurd. Respect for Spanish culture & history is one thing, opposition to ethnic swamping completely another.

  • MikeofAges

    Alcoholism is rife in the Jewish-American community. The highly religious avoid it, but the highly religious in all communities avoid alcoholism and addiction. Just look at Hollywood, or at the “singles” scene in major cities. No boundaries to this issue. Not in America.

  • MikeofAges

    Baron Kaldian wrote: “As for English vs other languages- this is absurd. Respect for
    Spanish culture & history is one thing, opposition to ethnic
    swamping completely another.”Former Colorado governor Richard Lamm put a bottom line on the issue. He called knowing a second language a “blessing” but called living a bilingual society a curse. Couldn’t agree more. The exceptions are countries with highly developed concepts of civic virtue. Belgium. Switzerland. Maybe Canada (or maybe not).

  • Hirene

    We have a food stamp economy and non-whites have plenty of money for beer and Verizon.    Any company that tries to appeal to the white consumer will be sued for discrimination, but not the other way around.