Germany Loses German Face

Vadim Trukhachev, Pravda, October 4, 2011

Germany celebrated the Day of the German Unity. A local statistics agency prepared a peculiar “gift” for this date. It published the data showing that almost one fifth of the country’s population is immigrants.

According to the statistics, out of 81.7 million residents, immigrants make up 15.7 million, or 19.3 percent. Slightly more than half of them (8.6 million) hold German passports. The highest percentage of residents who moved to Germany from other countries are from Turkey (14.1 percent), Poland (10.5 percent) and Russia (9.2 percent). The Volga Germans are predominant among them, but there are also Jews, Russians and representatives of the peoples of the Caucasus.

However, the number of 19.3 percent can be viewed as somewhat exaggerated. The German statistics considers non-indigenous populations not only those who came to the country after 1950, but also their descendants. As a result nearly one in three immigrants is not an immigrant, but a native of Germany (6.3 percent of those counted.) However, the number of 12.9 percent of natives of other states is very impressive. Apparently, this number will be growing further. The average age of immigrants is 11 years younger than that of the indigenous Germans, and in each of the next generations their share will be even higher than the current average. Yet, immigrant issues are not limited to the numbers only. Apparently they adversely affect socio-economic indicators.


The ratio of those who have not completed secondary education among immigrants is 15 percent, while among the native Germans it is only two percent. 45 percent of the immigrants do not have any special professional training (there are fewer than 20 percent of those among the Germans). The unemployment rate among the immigrants is 11.5 percent while among the locals this number is 5.8 percent. The risk of falling into poverty among immigrants is 26.2 percent, and among the Germans–11.7.

Immigrants from Muslim countries cause the biggest concern for the Germans. Recently the detention near Bonn of four young men suspected of connections to Islamist organizations was reported. As a result these detainees were released, but in other cases evidence of a link with the terrorists was found rather quickly. It was established that many participants in the September 11 attacks of 2001 were parishioners of a mosque in Hamburg, whose activities were curtailed.

Currently, there are 4.3 million Muslims in Germany (over five percent of the population). Approximately two-thirds of them are the Turks, while others are mainly Arabs, Kurds, Albanians and Bosnian Muslims. Approximately 45 percent of them have German passports, while the desire to be fully integrated into German society was expressed only by 25 percent. Did Chancellor Angela Merkel, acknowledging that the integration of Muslims into German society failed, mean exactly that?
The number of mosques has increases exponentially. In 1970, Germany had only three mosques, and today there are over 2,500 of them (an increase is impressive, even taking into account the fact that today this statistic includes the territory of the former GDR). Three years ago the authorities in Cologne have given permission for the construction of mosques and minarets which originally were supposed to be above the domes of the famous local cathedral. Only after numerous protests the height of minarets was reduced.

As in neighboring France and Belgium, there have been attempts in Germany to limit the use of hijab in schools. Back in 2003, the Constitutional Court of Germany allowed individual lands to introduce respective bans. As a result, Bavaria, Baden-Wuerttemberg and North Rhine-Westphalia banned teachers from wearing Muslim headscarves. Berlin decided to ban all religious symbols. Interestingly, many Turks support these restrictions. Social-Democrat of Turkish origin Leyla Akgun called the headscarf a prison threatening human rights. 


There are numerous examples of successful integration of Muslims into German society: film director Fatih Akin, singer Tarkan, the German national football team players Mesut Ozil and Sami Hedira. Some ethnic Turks were able to launch political careers–for example, co-chairman of the Green Party Cem Özdemir, or the Minister of Education of Saxony Aygul Ozkan. Up to a third of the German Muslims do not attend mosques, and in this sense, Germany is more successful in integrating immigrants than France or England. Yet, the problem still remains.

A study conducted 18 months ago showed that the number of Germans worried about the growing number of the followers of Islam is very large. For example, 36 percent expressed serious concern about “creeping Islamization” of Germany, and another 39 percent–a slight concern. If we consider that the birth rate among Muslims is much higher than that among the Germans, the above mentioned numbers may become higher.


However, so far Muslims do not predominate among immigrants in Germany, accounting for just over 20 percent. Nearly 32 percent of foreign-born are immigrants from the current EU countries. Poles lead the competition with 1.7 million of the country’s nationals residing in Germany. This number is probably somewhat understated. Many go to work in Germany from the neighboring regions of Poland (for example, from the city of Szczecin) and do not need to obtain German residency as they return home every day. In addition, Germany employs half a million Italians, 370,000 Greeks, and over 100 thousand Portuguese.
A significant portion of non-Muslim immigrants are from the former Soviet countries (over two million people). They are dominated by the Volga Germans from Russia and Kazakhstan. In addition, as a justification for the Holocaust, the Germans welcomed several hundred thousand of Jews to the country. This is not counting Russian wives, half-breeds, economic immigrants, and immigrants from the Northern Caucasus. As a result, approximately three percent of the population of Germany speaks Russian.


In addition, a large number of Serbs (over half a million), Croats (250 thousand) and citizens of other republics of former Yugoslavia work in Germany. Many of them were born in Germany and have two passports–a German one and one of their own ethnic homelands. Finally, there are large German cities similar to Chinatowns. Their residents include people from sub-Saharan Africa (few hundred thousand).

Certain issues are shared by many Muslim immigrants and immigrants from Christian and other countries. The main issue is poor knowledge of the German language and consequent difficulties in getting decent jobs. Many children of “non-native” Germans join the ranks of organized crime. This is a source of frustration for the indigenous Germans promoting the growth of the nationalist sentiment, as well as undermining the principle of seemingly stable German government and society.
21 years ago Germany was reunited. Many thought that the dividing lines in the country were abolished once and for all. However, today a number of new boundaries (national, religious, mental, etc.) representing a challenge to Germany as a German national state have been identified in the country. The peace not only in their own country but also across Europe depends on the success of the German authorities in coping with it. In the meantime, they are not coping too well, and the country is losing its German face. This was acknowledged by Chancellor Merkel and former head of the Bundesbank Thilo Sarrazin in his scandalous book Deutschland Schafft Sich Ab (“Germany is digging its own grave.”)

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  • John Bell

    As always, treat statistics with caution. Many, probably most, of the “immigrants” from Poland and Russia will be Germans (Volksdeutsche), in fact it specifically states that most of the Russians are Volga Germans.

  • ATBOTL

    Many of the immigrants to Germany are ethnic Germans from Eastern Europe and many of the rest are other Europeans. Overall, most of their immigrants are white. Turks are better behaved and more closely related to Europeans than Arabs and Pakistanis too. Overall, the situation in Germany is no where near as bad as it is in the USA, UK or France.

  • Anonymous

    I agree with #2. Turks have been around in Germany since the 1960s, more now than then, but they are Germany’s “manageable” minority, who live in their enclaves. Meanwhile, there are virtually no blacks, Hispanics, or Asians, in terms of percentage.

  • Anonymous

    #2 Turks civilized? I take it that you have never met a kurd or turk. They have an average IQ about equal to mexicans (actually a bit less IIRC) and are very violent.

  • Anonymous

    One big thing Germany does have going for it is that it does NOT have birthright citizenship laws.

  • geradeaus dan rechts

    “Berlin decided to ban all religious symbols. Interestingly, many Turks support these restrictions.”

    Secular Turks will assimilate to German norms, but still retain their distinctiveness (much as Jews in pre-Nazi Germany, or the Irish in 19th century America). Any modern society needs to be able to accommodate ethnic minorities who play by the rules. What should not be tolerated are ethnic minorities who flout the norms of the host country, or –even worse– insist on special privileges.

    It is America, of all the countries on the Earth, that has advanced furthest on the path of privileging an extremely deviant ethnic minority.

  • ATBOTL

    Never said Turks were “civilized,” only that they cause less problems than Arabs and Pakistanis do. Reading comprehension.

  • TomSwift

    I believe Turks have an average IQ of 90 while most of the immigrants the rest of us are burdened with are around 80.

    So the problem isn’t as bad in Germany (yet).

  • rockman

    old story what makes a German. Does a piece of paper make a German or does heritage make a German. Can a turk be a real German or is he always a turk. how long before the Rhine becomes a tribal hunting ground? Mosques to not belong in Germany.

  • Anonymous

    #4 is quite correct about the Turks, who place n inordinate burden on social services here. The african immigrant population is also growing quickly, both ethiopian christians, but also many muslims.

    Germany is heading for a disaster.

    BTW, I am seeing more “Tiggers” each day, i.e. “urban” dressing youts.

  • Anonymous

    Germans are repeating the historical failures of others.

    The ancient Greeks and Romans, and the early Americans of the Southern States, thought they could cheat the limitations of the national labour pool by bringing in slaves to increase productive output.

    The slaves are still there.

  • Anonymous

    The Albanian (Thracians/Illyrians) and Bosniak (Southern Slavs) immigrants might be “Muslims” now, but they are both indigenous Europeans who converted to Islam during the Ottoman period in the Balkans. For the record, both are overwhelmingly secular, and are neither Turks nor Arabs:

    European Y-Chromosome DNA: http://goo.gl/tCew

  • s

    Ancient Asia minor was such a diversified country that the romans divided it into over 20 provinces, for the sake of calm. The real Turkish appearance come along with muslim conquest about 1200ad. Emigrating from Turkey does not mean you are ethnic Turkish. The real population of Asia Minor was much the same as the Greek.

  • Deniz

    #2 Turks civilized? I take it that you have never met a kurd or turk. They have an average IQ about equal to mexicans (actually a bit less IIRC) and are very violent.

    ___

    Nonsense. 50%, probably more of the so-called “Turks” in Germany are not ethnic Turks and not considered as Turks in Turkey (Kurds, Arabs, other minorities from the Eastern Anatolia).

    Holding a Turkish passport doesn’t make you Turk as Amreners always state that a black from Senegal is not a Frenchmen.

    And yes, most of the Turks are civilized, although not all, as not all whites are civilized and some of them are very violent.

    You have to read a bit about our history (of course not from a fundamental christian perspective) and you will quickly realize that a comparison between us and mestizos from the remotest parts of Mexico doesn’t make much sense.

  • Deniz

    This article seems to be quite depressive but the situation is not very bad.

    These “immigrants” are mostly ethnic Germans from Russia and Eastern Europe while the others are predominantly from white countries (Italy, former Yugoslavia, some other Slavic countries, minor Western Europeans). Plus Turks who live very separetely from the German people.

    Blacks are not too many, apart from the Southwest (French border), Asians and Hispanics are negligible.

    The only problem is the extremely low birthrate among German women. Well, whos to blame? I guess, some people from the USA who wants to make them extinct, correct me if I’m wrong…

  • elitist

    The Turks as a group are less violent & crime-prone than Arabs and North Africans, but it’s all relative.

    Explains why Germany is relatively calm despite the massive invasion underway.

    I doubt if the Turks are significantly more intelligent than Arabs and North Africans – in general, Muslims in Europe have IQs comparable to African-Americans and Mexican Americans, i.e. with averages in the low 80s.

    In other words, they are simply not competitive, the MOST one can hope for, therefore, is that they are steady workers & law-abiding citizens who contribute nothing in taxes but receive quite a lot of government services.

    Even in a best case scenario, therefore, their presence in Europe in great numbers can only mean the end of European civilization through the steady deterioration caused by social decay and lowered standards.

    Unfortunately, the worst-case scenario is cvil war in the coming decades as indigenous Europeans wake up to the fact that the invaders hate us and want to enslave and destroy us.

  • Arab guy

    @ 4 — Anonymous

    I am an arab guy in Germany. You are true, arabs are violent and mostly not very educated.

    The point is: Compared to who?

    Compared to the Germans? Definitely!

    Compared to blacks? Definitely not!

    I have read a bunch of comments on German blogs from people in France, Britain, Belgium and the Netherlands, saying Germans shouldn’t be so whiny. They say: “At least you have turks, they are the smart Third worlders. You don’t have real problems! We have Sub-Saharan blacks. Try to deal with them. Even arabs and turks go away from their behavior.”

    I have a hard-leftwing communist. He went to Belgium for a few years. When he came back, he still was a communist. All people are the same – except blacks.

    I started to argue because I was liberal and he told me: “You are defending blacks because you haven’t been around them!” He was true.

    All in All, turks are going the same way as whites: The low-IQ ones breed and from the former many blond blue-eyed turks there is nearly nothing left.

  • Anonymous

    @ No. 3. Excuse me, Sir, but nearly every word you wrote in incorrect. “Virtually no blacks, Hispanics, or Asians…” is wrong; people from Subsahara Africa can be seen everywhere, large and steadily growing numbers of Chinese and Vietnamese live in Germany. In some cities, there is a visible “Hispanic” minority, many come from South America and do have a Spanish passport. Since Germany`s borders are virtually open, the ethnic mixture and the loss of Germany traditions, language, cultural heritage and characteristics is striking.

  • unforgiven

    Turks are turks. Germans think they can “manage” them. Germans are wrong. Germans only see color. They have a much harder time recognizing honor. The Jews had honor. You’ve replaced them with Turks. Good luck with that.

  • Anonymous

    #14 You must remember that multiculturalism and internationalism was forced on Germany by gunpoint by USA, UK, France and the Soviet Union. It was not something they voluntarily adapted.

  • Anonymous

    #9 I am well aware that turks and kurds consider themselves different people. Thats why I mentioned both. Turks belong to the same strata of swarthy minor asian people as kurds, armenians, azerbadians, syrians and many more.

    One thing they all have in common is that they are very quarrelsome and consider themselves special (and demand special treatment in social matters), and if they are not fighting an outsider (that is, their very neighbours) they are fighting among themselves, often literally on the street. From a northen european perspective they are insane and highly destructive, both against themselves and the people around them. From their perspective we are cowards and wimps.

  • Anonymous

    19 — unforgiven wrote at 10:01 AM on October 6:

    Turks are turks. Germans think they can “manage” them. Germans are wrong. Germans only see color. They have a much harder time recognizing honor. The Jews had honor. You’ve replaced them with Turks. Good luck with that.

    —————————————————

    Really? I have a problem with Germans replacing ethnic GERMANS, period! Not someone who claims they are German. Are you saying the ethnic German people had no honor? I don’t quite get the meaning of your post.

    —————————

    20 — Anonymous wrote at 10:19 AM on October 6:

    #14 You must remember that multiculturalism and internationalism was forced on Germany by gunpoint by USA, UK, France and the Soviet Union. It was not something they voluntarily adapted.

    ———————————–

    So true, just like they have done to us Whites in the good ole USA.. Those nations you mentioned were MARXISTS within those governments. They are everywhere in our once White nations and have been for eons.

  • Integration Anxiety

    I have heard from scholars on the subject of poulations and demography that Turks are far and away the most secular of Muslims. Most do not let the insidiousness of religious fanaticism dominate what they learn in mosques. This is something to be valued. Like Deniz stated, there are some unsavory Turks. But also like ATBOTL stated, I would think they are more assimilated and better behaved than Arabs & Pakistanis. Because of the country’s proximity to Europe proper.

    That is something that I’ve noticed about several AmRen posters. They are anti-miscegenation, yet ironically it may be the only way to get the undesirables up to IQ & well behaved in a society. It’s a two-edge sword for sure.

  • Anonymous

    The REAL QUESTION is how many of these immigrants are non-EUROPEAN and how many of THESE are citizens.

    Also, in defense of Germany, and quite unlike Britian, France and the low countries, the Germans were not at all to blame for this. After the war Germany was pretty much under the control of the USA and the rest of Europe. The flooding of Germany was largely instituted by these bodies to serve their own purposes. The USA wanted Germany to take in Turks to please its cold-war ally Turkey. It wasn’t Germany’s fault. What Germany does need to do is keep its laws against birthright citizenship, restrict all non-E.U. immigration, try to raise its birthrate ad enact very strong German language laws throughout the country.

  • Anonymous

    “You must remember that multiculturalism and internationalism was forced on Germany by gunpoint by USA, UK, France and the Soviet Union. It was not something they voluntarily adapted.”

    I disagree. Most Germans scream racism if you even suggest immigration control. Even German conservatives are very passive on this issue. Occasionally there is a modest criticism of immigration, but that is very rare. Far right groups, who are portrayed as violent wierdos, are the only vocal opposition to immigration. These groups are only a very small percentage of the population. Liberal Germans love their multiculturalism. Like the US, they hide black/brown on white crimes and preach passive forgiveness/weakness instead of justice. Prison terms for rapists and murderers are as short as one year.

    I will give you a shocking statistic: Obama currently has an 81% approval rating in Germany. Our racist President is loved by most Germans, even after his racist, violent affiliations became known. They generally hate George Bush. They HATE him. They view him as some kind of Christian nerd and a warmonger. The most popular music in Germany, even among the middle aged, is American gangsta rap. When i go there or watch their local Television, I feel like I’m in the twilight zone.

  • Sardonicus

    While I’m not sure the Turks belong in Germany, they are much preferable to the hordes of Mestizos, Cholos, Caribbean Blacks, and other assorted Third World types flooding the United States. The Turks, at one time, built a great Ottoman civilization; the flotsam and jetsam were getting never will. We are only a few decades away from becoming a Third World Banana Republic. Maybe, Germany can still preserve its racial and cultural heritage. I fear it’s too late for a European, First World America.

  • Greg

    You can stick a fork in it, the west is done.

    Just like Egypt, Rome, Greece, the hordes are taking over displacing and out breeding.

    The west will become a place that takes siestas and wastes half the day praying toward Mecca.

  • Anonymous

    23 — Integration Anxiety wrote at 11:11 AM on October 6:

    That is something that I’ve noticed about several AmRen posters. They are anti-miscegenation, yet ironically it may be the only way to get the undesirables up to IQ & well behaved in a society. It’s a two-edge sword for sure.

    ————————————

    What are you suggesting? That we Whites miscegenate with nonwhites some more, thereby diluting the White genetics into non existence? Mix the bloodline even more in hopes it helps bring the non whites “up”? Yeah, sure..no, thanks.

    I see how well that has worked out with Obama and all the rest of these mixed race peoples, including the Mexican population… Very well “behaved”, right? Have you not noticed that ALL half- White peoples ALWAYS side with their darker half AGAINST us?

  • Jason Robertson

    The Nazis believed in racial separation and a German Germany, allied to white nations of similar stock. The anti-Nazi legislation and powerful endless propaganda from 1945 to now has left its mark on the German mind, so that only a few think or act, or are allowed by law to speak, in a way considered “anti-racist”. With mass-immigration this can mean a non-German Germany, allied to non-white societies of mixed ethnicity. The intelligent, cultured and industrious Germans can see this, but there is an old saying nevertheless that if you point the Germans in one direction they all march together towards it. Once it was Danzig and Stalingrad, now it is Hamelin and Hell.

  • Anonymous

    20 — Anonymous wrote at 10:19 AM on October 6:

    #14 “You must remember that multiculturalism and internationalism was forced on Germany by gunpoint by USA, UK, France and the Soviet Union. It was not something they voluntarily adapted. ”

    Well, that’s a bit of a stretch. No one would have bothered Germany IF they hadn’t invaded, and brutally, Poland. They didn’t even care that they were arresting Jews, etc. But Nazis were operating in the U.S. with plans to overthrow it, and so on.

    Today, the problem for Germany and Europe is the EU and its policies. So why not get practical about it and offer solutions that might be employable?

  • Anonymous

    23 — Integration Anxiety wrote at 11:11 AM on October 6:

    “That is something that I’ve noticed about several AmRen posters. They are anti-miscegenation, yet ironically it may be the only way to get the undesirables up to IQ & well behaved in a society. It’s a two-edge sword for sure. ”

    You obviously have not thought this over. Since whites amount to 9% or so of the world’s population, the probability that interbreeding with whites will raise the level of humanity is impossible. The opposite will result; whites will be absorbed and their genetic influences quickly minimized, and then dispersed beyond noticeable expression. So the idea that allowing non-whites into Europe and absorbing them is only an argument for genocide.

    I can see a future where if a blond is born, they are regarded as magical and sold to the highest bidder for whatever use (from sexual to sacrifice). I’ve even thought of writing a science fiction based on a future where blonds are bred for pleasure and other social/cultural uses. Their hair already goes for high prices.

  • Anonymous

    12 — Anonymous wrote at 2:05 AM on October 6:

    “The Albanian (Thracians/Illyrians) and Bosniak (Southern Slavs) immigrants might be “Muslims” now, but they are both indigenous Europeans who converted to Islam during the Ottoman period in the Balkans. For the record, both are overwhelmingly secular, and are neither Turks nor Arabs:”

    I lived in the Balkans and must report that this has only minimal application in reality. I studied the chart and what it leaves out is what is telling. It even leaves one with the impression that North Africans are more European than Arabic.

    Bosnian is the name for a Muslim ethnic group in Bosnia/Herzegovina, which has a common southern border with Croatia. The Bosnians are the population that resulted from forced marriages to Turks with the children raised as Muslims. During the 500 years of Ottoman rule they were given the administration offices. This occurred elsewhere in the Ottoman Balkans. I even learned that many women were subject to systematic rape throughout the Balkans for insuring Turkish control. This is one reason for the extreme bitterness of Serbs for example, and especially Bosnian Serbs. Moreover, beyond these charts, there are subtleties that just cannot be accounted for. It is quite possible, with some practice, to know who is Albanian, who is Serb, who is Slovene, who is Croat, etc. Bosnian are particularly identifiable by appearance.

  • Anonymous

    29 — Jason Robertson wrote at 2:26 PM on October 6:

    “The Nazis believed in racial separation and a German Germany, allied to white nations of similar stock. ”

    Oh? Why did they have to invade Austria and not wait for a vote? And why did they have to threat Czechoslovakia and bargain via threat? Why did they ally with non-white Japan?

    I share the wish for Germany and white Europe to wake up and save itself from extinction, but arguments like yours are too easy to refute and find ridiculous. Better to attempt to teach a little self-respect, self-love, and indigenous cultural love. You’ll never do it through apologics for Nazism and WW2.

  • BannerRWB

    15-Deniz: “The only problem is the extremely low birthrate among German women. Well, whos to blame? I guess, some people from the USA who wants to make them extinct, correct me if I’m wrong…”

    – The inaccuracy in your comment is due to taking a statement that may be true for a small minority of people in the USA, and then applying it as if the overwhelming majority held such an opinion. In any case, there is very little anyone in the US can do regarding the low birthrate of German women. It seems to me that it is German women who have a much greater say on this particluar subject… please correct me if you think I am wrong.

  • Anonymous

    Many comments here I see are playing the blame game…

    The only ones who are responsible for the demographic decline of ethnic Germans in Germany are GERMANS themselves.

    If you believe this is a problem, then YOU as Germans need to be proactive and do something to reverse it.

    Perhaps I am generalizing/stereotyping, but both whites and blacks have a knack for blaming others for their woes. Is this behavior biological/genetic/cultural?

    I find this quite distasteful.

  • (AWG) Average White Guy

    Europe is facing an economic meltdown.

    (I wonder why.)

  • Jason Robertson

    Re #33. My “arguments” were not an “apology” for the Nazis; my reference to the invasion of Poland and Russia surely refutes any such smear. I shall therefore not be drawn into commenting on the origins and course of WW2 which could then be similarly twisted as “Nazi”.

    My explanation of official “anti-racism” in modern Germany (and not only there) as the “reverse” of official “racism” in Nazi Germany is pretty obvious, well documented, and largely common consent among all shades of opinion.

    Yes, we should put the past behind us and focus on “indigenous cultural self-love” for the European future.

  • Anonymous

    Reply to #30:

    Modern Poland was only created in 1920 out of the wreckage of WW1. It helped itself to a large part of Germany, including some of its most valuable lands, like the highly productive coalfields of southern Silesia. Over two million ethnic Germans were captive citizens of Poland in 1939. Poland also ruled over Danzig, a city that was about 100% German and overwhelmingly wanted to rejoin Germany. In fact only about 64% of Poland’s population was ethnically Polish. Poland was ruled by a despotic military Junta that happily joined Hitler in carving up Czechoslovakia in 1938. Poland was no innocent babe in the woods. As early as 1920 many British statesmen realized the crazy borders between Germany and Poland would someday lead to another war. Imagine a stretch of Canadian territory running from Cornwall-Montreal southward until it reached the Atlantic, cutting off the whole of New England from the rest of the USA while New York City was administered by some bogus “league of nations mandate” under Canadian suzerainity. Just how long would Americans tolerate that? Even if Hitler had never existed, there would PROBABLY have been a German-Polish war sooner or later. As writers like Major-General J.F.C. Fuller and Patrick Buchanan have noted the REAL MISTAKE was Neville Chamberlain’s INSANE pledge to Poland. This made a general war unavoidable.

  • Anonymous

    30 — Anonymous wrote at 3:56 PM on October 6:

    20 — Anonymous wrote at 10:19 AM on October 6:

    #14 “You must remember that multiculturalism and internationalism was forced on Germany by gunpoint by USA, UK, France and the Soviet Union. It was not something they voluntarily adapted. “

    Well, that’s a bit of a stretch. No one would have bothered Germany IF they hadn’t invaded, and brutally, Poland. They didn’t even care that they were arresting Jews, etc. But Nazis were operating in the U.S. with plans to overthrow it, and so on.

    Today, the problem for Germany and Europe is the EU and its policies. So why not get practical about it and offer solutions that might be employable?

    ————————————–

    Well, maybe you need to do some more research instead of relying on what our “history” tells us…The Treaty of Versailles was a travesty FOR Germany. Tell me what treaty we have signed over the decades that are a plus to us? As for Neville Chamberlain..that guy was the evil one.

    From Pat Buchanan

    German tanks, however, did not roll into Poland until a year later, Sept. 1, 1939. Why did the tanks roll? Because Poland refused to negotiate over Danzig, a Baltic port of 350,000 that was 95 percent German and had been taken from Germany at the Paris peace conference of 1919, in violation of Wilson’s 14 Points and his principle of self-determination.

    Hitler had not wanted war with Poland. He had wanted an alliance with Poland in his anti-Comintern pact against Joseph Stalin.

    But the Poles refused to negotiate. Why? Because they were a proud, defiant, heroic people and because Neville Chamberlain had insanely given an unsolicited war guarantee to Poland. If Hitler invaded, Chamberlain told the Poles, Britain would declare war on Germany.

    From March to August 1939, Hitler tried to negotiate Danzig. But the Poles, confident in their British war guarantee, refused. So, Hitler cut his deal with Stalin, and the two invaded and divided Poland.

    The cost of the war that came of a refusal to negotiate Danzig was millions of Polish dead, the Katyn massacre, Treblinka, Sobibor, Auschwitz, the annihilation of the Home Army in the Warsaw uprising of 1944, and 50 years of Nazi and Stalinist occupation, barbarism and terror.

    Also this:

    http://giwersworld.org/wwii/wwii-summ.phtml

    http://www.whycenter.com/why-germany-invaded-poland/

  • Integration Anxiety

    Let me explain what.I was speaking of. I am not encouraging miscegenation. I am simply stating that if you put x amount of Whites into a reproduction chamber with the same x amount of non-White over time you bring up the IQ of the African. I realize that Northern Asians who miscegenate with Whites would bring up our IQ. I understand that we are barely 10% of the worlds populace. So how do we gain more power and influence? Make a truce with those societies who are comparable to our own. Although we haven’t been at war with Japan and Korea for several decades. A Caucasian only homeland is desirable but probably not attainable. Associate with the winners not the sinners.

  • Deniz

    The inaccuracy in your comment is due to taking a statement that may be true for a small minority of people in the USA, and then applying it as if the overwhelming majority held such an opinion. In any case, there is very little anyone in the US can do regarding the low birthrate of German women. It seems to me that it is German women who have a much greater say on this particluar subject… please correct me if you think I am wrong.

    ___

    http://goo.gl/e8zvC

    I don’t know whether you are familiar with post-war plans like this or others and I can’t prove whether they’ve been officially implemented or not but the goals aimed in that are about to be reached, e.g. birthrates extremely low, very high numbers of foreigners have been settling since 1950s, Germans have become the most brainwashed and re-educated people in the world.

    That’s the reason why it HAS TO do with the people in the USA since this trash culture, lifestyle and mentality and never ending guiltiness and its consequences (not talking about problems that may have associated with non-Germans, birthrates because they may be racist(!)) were imposed BY THE USA.

    And yet, despite all, Germans still praise the USA, unbelievable…. For instance, as one user stated, they love Obama more than Americans. Isn’t it a sign of successful brainwashing and reeducation?

    Congratulations boys, you made it. Those damn Huns(!) were crushed and your divine ideology flourishes right here in the middle of Europe!

  • Anonymous

    It’s Poster 38 who has the selective memory.

    As any schoolboy knows ‘Germany’ did not exist as a state until the 1870s (Poland existed as a unitary state since the 10th century).

    The modern nation of ‘Germany’ is in fact,the consolidation of Prussia conducted laregely by Bismark – who engaged in many aggressive wars against his neighbors to ensure that end.Rapacious wars of territorial conquest were launched against Denmark and France for example, and an aggressive war against Austria was launched.

    Furhermore, Poland, historically, was the laeding state of east/central Europe.During a period of internal decline it was King Frederick of Prussia who instigated the partition of Poland assembling the fellow conspirators of Russia and Austria.Huge areas of Polish territory were expropriated by Prussia.

    In fact both Russia and Prussia only rose to ascendancy in the 18th century.This was mainly because both nations filled the vacuum previously taken by Poland.

  • Salt

    When I lived in Germany in the mid 90’s I had very few problems with the Turks. My experience with Germans was that they were not terribly kind to guest workers in general, and to some degree resented them no matter where they were from. They especially resented having an American supervisor who didn’t, and still doesn’t have complete mastery of their language. Until I was able to win over my German coworkers, I spent a lot of my off time with the Turks, and I found them to generally be fairy polite, reasonably law abiding, decent people, who were much more laid back than the Germans were. However, most of the Turks I met were Christians, or secular, and if they were Muslim they were not terribly hardcore about it. A lot of the Turks I met were actually born in Germany; their parent having come over in the 1960’s, and 1970’s. The Turks, and a fairly large number of Greeks living in Germany made my adjustment to Hamburg a lot easier than it would have been otherwise. For the most part they seemed to adjust fairly well to German society, but they knew they were going to be looked at as an outsider there, and accepted that even if they were born in Germany that this was the way it was. Germany was at least 90% German back then, and probably closer to 95% German. The one thing the Germans had that the Turks lacked a bit was an absolute sense of punctuality. If you called the phone company, or the cable company and they said they would be there at 9:02am, they were there at 9:01:44am ringing the doorbell. While the Turks weren’t quite as law abiding as native Germans, they were not exactly out terrorizing the streets either. I wouldn’t completely call the Germans law abiding, but they have a highly developed sense of order that is a part of their culture, and they don’t deviate from it much. Even the heroin dealers, and cigarette smugglers in Germany said please, and thank you. Its a different world from what I was used to in America. Tax evasion was a national past time for a great many Germans, and the penalties were pretty insane for it, but there were many ways to go about it. Crimes that were considered serious here were often dealt with as trivial matters there.

    My first encounter with a Turk was after a particularly frustrating day trying to adjust to Germany, learning to navigate an unfamiliar city, struggling with the language, and a business & legal culture I was unfamiliar with. The first Turk I met poured me a couple shots of alcohol on the house because he said “You look like you need it today”, and from then on I spent a lot of time with them. The Turks, and to a lesser extent the Greeks tend to separate themselves during their off time. I met a number of other foreign nationals while working in Germany, and many of them found their way into the Turkish, and Greek enclaves because of the hospitality of the Turks. The Turks & Greeks were incredibly hospitable to me, and to other foreign nationals. They were also generally a pleasure to do business with.

    The Germans were a little harder to get used to. The Germans, on average, didn’t care much for foreign workers, and there was active resent of them as unemployment was very high for several years after the Berlin wall came down. While some Germans did speak ill of the Turks; I didn’t have the sense of the degree of division, and animosity that exist between blacks, and whites in America. Maybe that division is greater than I could perceive as an outsider.

    The Germans I knew didn’t like me at first because I was an American, didn’t fully grasp their language, and was potentially taking a job away from a native German. However, they did respect skills. When I was able to demonstrate I had technical skills that they didn’t, completely understood the systems we were working on better than they did, and was struggling my hardest to overcome the language barrier so I could teach them what was needed to maintain these systems so I could go home – the resentment disappeared among those I worked with, and supervised. It took a lot longer to break some of those barriers down than I expected, and to build friendships with them. There are still parts of German culture that are more difficult for me to accept. They lack a lot in the tact department, and it took me awhile to figure out that it was not meant in a hurtful way, but just a part of their normal culture.

    When I left Germany was just starting to get a handful of African immigrants. The Africans were not assimilating well at all. For reasons I do not understand, rather than allow the Germans to talk about it, and come up with solutions to the problem; the government made it quasi-illegal to discuss the problems Africans were causing if you identified them as Africans. So some things got painted with a larger brush to get around this issue, and still try to maintain some sense of freedom of speech. There were tremendous social sanctions as well, so you had to speak about things in code. Those laws seemed to be wielded almost at random, but at other times targeted at political enemies. We take it for granted in America, but many of the things I have posted on this forum could land me in jail, or get me fined in Germany. Those types of speech laws were just beginning to get into full swing when I left.

    Even though I enjoyed the company of the Turks, and Greeks; living in Germany was a bit like being taken back into a time machine of what I imagine a mostly racially homogenous America was like in the 1950’s. I could wander the streets at 3am in perfect safety in Hamburg. Its something I could never do in St Louis. The cities were clean, nearly everything was functional, people took pride in their city, house, and street. The sense of community, and nation was incredibly strong everywhere I went.

    Residents would come out, and sweep their own sidewalks in front of their houses, and their neighbors sidewalks. They would fix things just because they needed fixing, even if it was something that might well be on city property. It was also one of the best engineered placed I have ever lived. I have a healthy respect, and admiration for the skills of the German machinists I did business with. Their machinists did incredible work with tolerances I have never seen matched in America. I could almost always count on anything I had to have custom fitted to be better than, or equal to the Japanese or American part it was intended to replace, and for purely custom parts – to fit, and work smoothly the first time. No casting marks, no burrs, no ill fitting threads; even parts that didn’t truly need it were polished to gloss, and perfect smoothness. The Germans were one of the most highly skilled work forces I have ever worked with. I could take it for granted that I wouldn’t have to teach things like formulas for making things square, or have to double check on work once the logic of why a process was needed was explained once. In America you have to give a math skills test just to get ensure you have someone competent to run a cash register. In Germany the average worker has either gone on to get an advanced degree, or has graduated from one of the many technical institutes that taught them a useful trade. (Often these skills are not in balance with what the economy is demanding at the moment, but if you hired someone fresh out of the institute it was like getting someone with several years experience here, and so long as you could explain the why something was needed, they could handle the how.)

    There were things I didn’t like. In some ways their government was very intrusive, and you don’t get that type of conformity to order without sanctions existing in every level of society. The East Germans in particular were leery of saying the wrong thing, and I maybe made the mistake of attributing their mistrust to having lived under communism, but looking back I think it was more that they had seen the writing on the wall, and that mistrust was learned because it serve a meaningful purpose.

    It was incredibly depressing to come back to the United States. My first day back I cried at the sight of trash on the ground, roads in disrepair, and cities that had large segments that were no go zones. St Louis is a city that was built primarily by a mixture of French, and then later Germans. So the architecture was not that different, nor the quality of the original workmanship. While I realize most of Hamburg had to be rebuilt after WWII, and I was looking at a much newer city because of this; the contrast was so overwhelming that for the first time in my life I truly had a sense of what we have lost as a people due to our expanding black, and other immigrant populations. To some degree our other choices as a nation as well, but that is more than I would touch on here.

    While I had been to Canada many times, and I love our Canadian brothers to the north; my trips there never had the impact that Germany did upon my views of the value of having a mostly homogenous race, and culture. Maybe I missed something during my trips to Canada, or didn’t stay long enough to get a sense of it, but the Canadians never seemed to place as much value on their identity as the Germans did. It saddens me greatly to think that the German people are slowly losing what made Germany such a great place to be, and are likely still facing legal sanctions should they speak about it plainly.

  • Flossie

    Greg wrote: “The west will become a place that takes siestas and wastes half the day praying toward Mecca.” Ha! Tragicomic but true. We’ve become a society of feckless children.

  • Anonymous

    Salt,

    By definition, there’s no such thing as a christian Turk.

    It’s like saying that there were muslim Italians living in pre-1945 Italy.

  • Anonymous

    #45:

    There are Christian sects and communities all throughout the Middle East, including Turkey. Turkish Christians have faced extremely violent persecution, even to this day. Most of their villages have been burned to the ground and deserted. Many fled to Europe. They are not all Armenian Turks either. Some Arab Christians are new converts, and some Christian communities are over 1000 years old. There are large Christian communities in the Palestinian territories, Lebanon, and Syria…a double digit percentage of the population, in some cases. Curiously, Christian communities thrived in Saddam Hussein’s Iraq. Now they are hunted and killed by local fanatics. Christians and Jews thrived as well in the Shah’s Iran. Now they are severely persecuted in the Islamic state. Christianity, as well as Judaism, were in integral part of the Middle East, at one time. Christianity is still going strong in Palestine…that’s why it irks me that my tax dollars are being used to bomb them.

  • Question Diversity

    43 Salt wrote:

    St Louis is a city that was built primarily by a mixture of French, and then later Germans. So the architecture was not that different, nor the quality of the original workmanship. While I realize most of Hamburg had to be rebuilt after WWII, and I was looking at a much newer city because of this; the contrast was so overwhelming that for the first time in my life I truly had a sense of what we have lost as a people due to our expanding black, and other immigrant populations.

    Strasbourg is the only Germanic city with centuries old Germanic architecture left in Europe, and that only happened because the Allies recaptured the Alsace “back” for France before the intense bombing of German cities began toward the end of WWII. The only places left where you’ll find anything approximating old German building stock? You and I live in such a place.

  • Brendan

    There are Christian sects and communities all throughout the Middle East, including Turkey. Turkish Christians have faced extremely violent persecution, even to this day.

    There are almost no Christians in Turkey. Almost none. A mere 100,000 in a population of over 70 million is a needle in the proverbial haystack. And if we consider ethnic Turks, we CAN say none.

    Turkey, despite its secular, relatively civilized reputation, has succeeded in ethnically cleansing itself of Christians. Syria, Iraq, Lebanon, Egypt, Jordan, heck, even Israel… all have Christian minorities of at least a few percent. Not Turkey!

  • Anonymous

    Poster #38 replies to #42:

    It was actually FRANCE that declared war on Prussia in 1870 (as any schoolboy should know). Denmark occupied two German states and Bismark evicted the Danes from them. He simply wanted the bumbling Habsburgs in Vienna to stay out of the affairs of the German states.

    There is of course, and long has been, a core of Polish culture and political organization. But this doesn’t change anything I wrote. Poland in 1939 was a disaster waiting to happen. Less then two-thirds of its population was ethnically Polish, it was ruled by despots, and had acquired much valuable territory from a stronger country at a moment of its temporary weakness. Additionaly and even worse Poland bisected Germany in two, which was a recipe for disaster. If Poland was to insist on having an outlet to the sea, (the lack of which has never stunted Switzerland) it would have made more sense to have given it a slice of EASTERN EAST PRUSSIA, rather then the corridor which split Germany in two. No self-respecting country could accept that indefinetly. Certainly America wouldn’t tolerate a swathe of Canadian annexed territory splitting it in two. Poland also showed particularly poor judgement in its annexation of parts of Silesia, even after referendums showed a majority of the population wanted to remain part of Germany. The loss of these rich areas, into which the German state had invested a great deal of money, was a real slap in the face to Germany. Poland also had borders that lacked natural frontiers. Poland would have been much better off if it had accepted a smaller state with workable borders that didn’t compromise a stronger neighbour and gave it a much more homogeneous population.

  • Allisio Rex

    You can stick a fork in it, the west is done.

    Just like Egypt, Rome, Greece, the hordes are taking over displacing and out breeding.

    The west will become a place that takes siestas and wastes half the day praying toward Mecca.

    Not if the people follow my liberation plan through massive non-violent uprising. There is still a way out.

  • One of my all time special quotes seems extremely fitting here “Success is nothing more than a few simple disciplines, practiced every day; while failure is simply a few errors in judgment, repeated every day. It is the accumulative weight of our disciplines and our judgments that leads us to either fortune or failure.”–Jim Rohn