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Swimmers Are Told to Wear Burkinis

More news stories on Britain

Patrick Sawer, Telegraph (London), August 15, 2009

UK councils running restricted swimming session for Muslims

Under the rules, swimmers—including non-Muslims—are barred from entering the pool in normal swimming attire.

Instead they are told that they must comply with the “modest” code of dress required by Islamic custom, with women covered from the neck to the ankles and men, who swim separately, covered from the navel to the knees.

The phenomenon runs counter to developments in France, where last week a woman was evicted from a public pool for wearing a burkini—the headscarf, tunic and trouser outfit which allows Muslim women to preserve their modesty in the water.

The 35-year-old, named only as Carole, is threatening legal action after she was told by pool officials in Emerainville, east of Paris, that she could not wear the outfit on hygiene grounds.

But across the UK municipal pools are holding swimming sessions specifically aimed at Muslims, in some case imposing strict dress codes.

Croydon council in south London runs separate one-and-a half-hour swimming sessions for Muslim men and women every Saturday and Sunday at Thornton Heath Leisure Centre.

Swimmers were told last week on the centre’s website that “during special Muslim sessions male costumes must cover the body from the navel to the knee and females must be covered from the neck to the ankles and wrists”.

There are similar rules at Scunthorpe Leisure Centre, in North Lincolnshire, where “users must follow the required dress code for this session (T-shirts and shorts/leggings that cover below the knee)”.

In Glasgow, a men-only swimming session is organised by a local mosque group at North Woodside Leisure Centre, at which swimmers must be covered from navel to knee.

At a women-only class organised by a Muslim teacher at Blackbird Leys Swimming Pool, Oxford, to encourage Muslim women to learn to swim, most participants wear “modest” outfits although normal costumes are permitted.

The dress codes have provoked an angry reaction among critics who say they encourage division and resentment between Muslims and non-Muslims, putting strain on social cohesion.

Ian Cawsey, the Labour MP for the North Lincolnshire constituency of Brigg and Goole, said: “Of course swimming pools have basic codes of dress but it should not go beyond that.

“I don’t think that in a local authority pool I should have to wear a particular type of clothes for the benefit of someone else. That’s not integration or cohesion.”

Labour MP Anne Cryer, whose Keighley, West Yorkshire constituency has a large number of Muslims, said: “Unfortunately this kind of thing has a negative impact on community relations.

“It’s seen as yet another demand for special treatment. I can’t see why special clothing is needed for what is a single-sex session.”

Muslim swimming sessions are also held at a number of state schools around the country. At Loxford School in Ilford, east London, a local Muslim group organises weekly sessions for Muslim men, with the warning that “it is compulsory for the body to be covered between the navel and the knees.

“Anyone not adhering to the dress code or rules within the pool will not be allowed to swim”.

The practice of holding special Muslim swimming sessions has led to non-Muslims being turned away.

David Toube, 39 and his five year old son Harry were last year refused entry to Clissold Leisure Centre, in Hackney, east London, after being told the Sunday morning swimming session was for Muslim men only.

Council officials later said staff had made a mistake and both Mr Toube, a corporate lawyer, and his son should have been admitted.

After discovering the rules at Thornton Heath one Croydon resident, 34-year-old Alex Craig, said: “I think it is preposterous that a council should be encouraging this type of segregation over municipal facilities.

“Surely if Muslims want to swim then they should just turn up with their modest swimwear at the same time as everyone else.”

Douglas Murray, director of the Centre for Social Cohesion, last night condemned the practice. He said: “This kind of thing is extremely divisive.

“Non-Muslims see these extremist demands as an example of Muslims wanting things to fit into their lifestyle, when there aren’t similar things organised for Hindus, Buddhists or Jews.

“It also puts moderate Muslims in an awkward position as it suggests, wrongly, that they are not devout enough, simply because they choose not to cover themselves in a shroud in a pool.”

A press officer at Croydon council, which introduced Muslim-only swimming in 2006, claimed that the wording on the website was a mistake and the dress code should be regarded as a suggestion rather than a requirement.

The website was late changed to remove the reference to the dress code.

However, an official at the leisure centre said the dress code remained compulsory.

Earlier, defending the segregation policy, a Croydon council spokesman said: “We appreciate that certain religious groups, such as Muslims, have strict rules on segregation for activities including sports, so in response to requests from the local community, we have been running these sessions at Thornton Heath Leisure Centre.”

Original article

(Posted on August 17, 2009)

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Comments

1 — Soprano Fan wrote at 6:59 PM on August 17:

This is absolute bullspit. Now, Britons are being told by their government what to wear in order to “appease” a minority religious sect. This is in addition to “Muslim-only” swim hours.

And yet, they have a problem with the BNP because the BNP wants Britain for the Brits.

I must have missed it, but, when the Englishmen turn into mad dogs?

2 — concernicus wrote at 7:51 PM on August 17:

This is ridiculous! People should be allowed to swim however the heck they feel like, burkini or bikini. If anyone is offended by that they can swim somewhere else or start their own seperate pool.

I also find it interesting to note that several cultures outside of Muslims wear burkha like attire and nobody says boo about it. Orthodox Greeks for example. Also what about Orthodox Jews, or the Amish? They don’t wear burkhas but they have just as strict appearance and manner requirements relating to women.

The fact we are wasting our time on this is allowing many other more serious problems to go by unnoticed. Has everyone gone mad?

3 — Dutchman wrote at 7:57 PM on August 17:

Someone tell me why female Nato soldiers are required to wear head coverings when operating in Afghanistan, and at the same time non-Muslims are now required to wear ‘burqinis’ in THEIR OWN COUNTRY so as not to offend Muslims?

Are Muslims such children that the sight of a head of hair might send them into a stupor of lust or rage?

4 — Anonymous wrote at 8:13 PM on August 17:

This is absolutely ridiculous. I weep for Britain. The nation they fought so hard for centuries, and built into an empire, is now being sold out from under them, by their subversive politicians. The old song “There will always be an England” has been proven untrue. They fought the Irish, who were actually much closer to their own people, religiously, and politically, only to give it away to a people, started off religious and political opposites. There is something so perverse and pathetic about it all.

5 — feller wrote at 8:19 PM on August 17:

Solution: Go back to Pakistan, Kuwait, etc. You go to Chriatian Britain, become a Christian or live secular life. Same goes for Jews. Britain is not the US, and it does not have the same history. No one should be beaten or harmed. But if you live in Britain, you live in a British Christian or secular way. Try being a Christian in Pakistan-your life is in constant danger. These people are utter hypocrites.

6 — xsader wrote at 8:33 PM on August 17:

Muslims have suddenly taken a great interest in learning to swim, or perhaps they just want to cause as much trouble as possible because they can take more and more knowing that Europeans will bend over backwards to accomodate them. None of this behavior is incidental. It’s deliberate, planned, and starts at places like swimming pools.

7 — flyingtiger wrote at 11:55 PM on August 17:

I wonder if these modest moslems shower or get the burkas wet? I doubt it.
Here is my plan to start the counter-Jihad: Co-ed nude swimming. I know some of you will objrct, but revolutions have been started for less.

8 — Anonymous wrote at 12:20 AM on August 18:

The Muslims are doing a better job of conquering Britain then the Nazis ever would have.

9 — Anonymous wrote at 12:26 AM on August 18:

Sounds to me like the queen would prefer the muslims to be her subjects. Little does she realize that when their numbers become great enough, she too will loose her head along with the rest of her family.

But on another note,. who would want to “swim” with their clothes on? Do they shower with their clothes on too?,.. oh excuse me, they DON’T shower.

10 — HH wrote at 1:45 AM on August 18:

And this from the people who gleefully spat upon “uptight” Christian morality for generations. Amazing how attitudes change…when race and ethnicity change as well. The hypocrisy of our times know no bounds.

11 — d wrote at 3:10 AM on August 18:

Concernicus - “The fact we are wasting our time on this is allowing many other more serious problems to go by unnoticed.”

The point is not that Muslims have segregated swimming and require their women to wear ugly cover-up bathers. The point is that they seek to exclude those who refuse to accept this dress code which is completely alien to mosern Western countries like Britain.

They seek to exclude British people from the local swimming pools built with their own taxes. Or to impose their alien customs and values onto the majority.

This is causing a lot of debate in Australia too because Muslims have tried the same thing here.

It is a ‘serious problem’ in itself because it’s a blatant attempt to force Muslim customs onto Western countries.

12 — Anonymous wrote at 4:28 AM on August 18:

This is absolutely ridiculous. I weep for Britain. The nation they fought so hard for centuries, and built into an empire, is now being sold out from under them, by their subversive politicians. The old song “There will always be an England” has been proven untrue. They fought the Irish, who were actually much closer to their own people, religiously, and politically, only to give it away to a people, started off religious and political opposites. There is something so perverse and pathetic about it all.
————————————————————————————————
Do you weep for lemmings that plunge over a clif? Really, there’s no one and nothing to weep for. A society that is cowed into this type of submission and disgrace is vacuous and without it’s soul. It’s long gone, friend.
People have to accept the change in the west…rather, Westerners of sanity need to acept that there’as a lemming instinct genetically programmed into many of their kin…those kin are hell-bent on cultural suicide and self-erasing their seed from the earth. They can not be dissuaded, or saved. Let them go their own way.
What are you going to do? lamment that these people (all over the West) loathe themselves, are without direction or sense, lack a spine, are unappreciative of their history, and are utterly unwilling to defend the inestimable bounty won through millenia of blood, sweat and tears (not to mention wisdom, kindness, benevolence, self-restraint, foresight, art, science, military prowess, daring, dash and vigour)?
Why try to convince a depressed person of great talent and goodness that their life is not worthless, just because they have flaws? If that person is deluded by a sadly biological illness, that’s just the way it is. They aren’t thinking straight, and “talk therapy” is like pissing in the wind for them. Simmilarly, why keep trying to convince self-hating Westerners that they must wear ash-and sack cloth and hair-shirts to attone for the wrongs of a greedy few of past generations, in the colonial era? It’s pointless. Depression is unammenable to reason, and deluded Westerners are simmilarly lost, without hope.
Again, who should weep for such people? They choose their own fate, even if it’s by sitting silently as they are replaced and squashed. If only it weren’t so…I too, love my people and my heritage…but it’s now decadent, effete, self-absorbed, weak, cowering, beholden to the absolute worst of cultural influences (vis Hip-Hop and Gangsta culture), and basically laying there on life support. How the West went from healthy and strong to shrivelled and insane is beyond me…I’m not spending any more time trying to figure it out, or shout the obvious truths to white folks plugging their ears with cement.
You should just move on…be a free individual, and tend to your loved ones.

13 — follow-up post wrote at 4:58 AM on August 18:

What I meant to say in my ramble before accidentally hitting the “post” button, is essentially a mediating statement; I don’t mean to be cruel to depressed people, I just want to illustrate that sometimes good and wonderful people are temporarily fixated on dreadful ideas, like believing they’re worthless and without hope.

Britons and Westerners in general need to learn by their own experience, and can’t be forced into some revalation by someone else’s moralizing. (AmRen and other such groups tend to lamment the obvious, and it’s clear that most of the world isn’t seeing things that way… call it right or wrong, you can’t just convince a social liberal they’re wrong).
The fact is obvious that many Brits, etc., are willing to accept these changes. They appear to be in the assendancy. So, Why fight them in a war of words?
Things have a way of working themselves out. As Western colonialists exploited the third world and eventually lost their footing due to greed( I think everyone here believes slavery was an abomination, and that exploiting technologically backward folks was thievery), so will the greedy element of “new colonialists” from the once colonized lands fail. The old order is always dying, and a new one is always being born. Old Britain is gone, surely as yesterday. But it will yet live, in a new way, and in time, Muslims of radical and violent passions will leave and/ or be forced to restrain themselves.
I’m no Neocon, but I believe that The radical Muslim world will shrink. I met too many Iranians who loved European freedoms to believe otherwise. We won’t shape the world to our view through wars, and we will make no progress trying to police the world, but ideas like freedom are infectious…and will beat out tyranny-religious, racial, ethnic or otherwise, in time.
Bad as it seems for the West, it will not die. Nor will it ever be the same…and it never was the same for very long, anyway.
Have hope and faith. A friend once told me.”The age of nations as we knew them may be passing, but the age of the individual will never die.” I certainly believe that hard times force change, and people only better themselves through strife and uncertainty.
Live strong and don’t look back. Your future is in tomorrow. Keep looking there.

14 — Kevin wrote at 9:57 AM on August 18:

“Are Muslims such children that the sight of a head of hair might send them into a stupor of lust or rage?”

Remember, these are the people who murdered over one hundred innocents and bombed embassies over some cartoons. There is no sense of reason or proportionality with such people.

15 — Anonymous wrote at 11:13 AM on August 18:

To 4:28 and 4:58, you had me with you somewhat, until the second post at 4:58 which basically sounds as though you are saying, Just give up, and forget about the White Europe, live our own lives, and don’t even think of fighting a lost cause. You describe whites as having a genetic weakness and a tendency towards behaving as lemming, yet later speak of those evil Westerners, and their history of exploitation, greed, colonization, and slavery. So I ask you, right or wrong, where was that weak lemming gene then? Where was it during the French revolution? Or the countless wars, Europeans fought tooth and nail for, for their land, and their culture? Hardly proof of a genetic weakness. More a sign today, that many Whites have been brainwashed, and programed into accepting their fate. I feel there are many who disagree with your “Don’t look back” philosophy, because that is indeed the mindset of a lemming, and also the mindset of the subversive politicians seeking to destroy Europe. I am full agreement of looking ahead, but ahead to a future where White Europeans still have a homeland, and their culture is intact.

16 — François wrote at 1:53 PM on August 18:

What the hell is wrong with the British?

Are we talking about the same nation that created the largest empire in human history? Why are they now bendind backwards to «not offend» Muslims?

17 — Anonymous wrote at 2:17 PM on August 18:

This article proves it. England is crazier than France. They take the prize. Hope they’re happy.

18 — matt wrote at 3:46 PM on August 18:

This is nothing new, my old local pool, the Reg Maxwell in Aylesbury (now closed) used to have a Friday night session for muslem women only who would wear burkini’s. EVERY MAN who was in the building, including staff were ordered out on a Friday evening to make way for the Muslem woman.

This was more than 10 years ago…

19 — Spartan24 wrote at 4:08 PM on August 18:

I have a problem with a publicly owned pool making this sort of requirement, or having a “Muslim only” hour or other time slot set aside. If you have a private pool then set whatever hours or slots you want. As a former Muslim I can say that if women are swimming with other women (only scenario likely) they do not need to wear such a dumb looking outfit to swim, the only thing different would be a suit that comes to the knee. So far, it has only been Muslims who make such demands of public facilities, I have never heard of a “Jewish only”, “Christian only” or other type of set aside. If the Muslims want this they need to build their OWN pool with their OWN money, leave tax dollars out of it.

20 — Anonymous wrote at 4:43 PM on August 18:

Here in Portland, Oregon, the public pools have single-sex swim times, during which no one of the opposite sex, employees included, is allowed to be present. They do not specify that the sessions are for Muslims, but the posted flyers that advertise them are written in Arabic as well as English, which is a bit of a clue. My best friend, an avid swimmer, has seen African Muslim immigrant girls, during regular open swim times, swimming in full Muslim dress and blue jeans. I can’t imagine a less swim-friendly costume.

21 — Lorin wrote at 5:46 PM on August 18:

Eventually, the question is: “Where does giving in to their demands stop?”
If there’s one thing I’ve learned in 6 decades of life ;it’s this; once you start giving in to blackmail, it will never stop. The demands grow, become more expensive, more frequent and the threats become more deadly.Normally, it’s stopped only after confrontation.
The truly unfortunate thing about these types of situations is that the government backs the offender; who always plays the victim card.
The solution? Haven’t a clue.

22 — William wrote at 12:58 PM on August 19:

What threatens so-called “community cohesion” is not adopting different rules for bathing gear for a diverse public, but the diversity itself, — the presence of large numbers of Muslims in a non-Muslim society. What the advocates of “diversity” never seem to mention is for it to work either Muslims must cease to be Muslims and become English or the English must become de facto Muslims or both must become some unspecified tertium quid. Attempts to force the first are the quickest way to encourage Islamic terrorism. The second will destroy the identity of the English and the third the identity of both. The second and third will also encourage societal violence. The only plausible option to maintain even a semblance of peace is to encourage repatriation and discourage the presence of Islam within England.

23 — François wrote at 3:38 PM on August 19:

Okay, so int his case, as in similar cases, Muslims living in our Western democracies would be offended, if WE didn’t do everything possible to accomodate THEM…

I say, Hey!, this is our home, our countries, where they are one minority among many others! And most people, around the entire world, do not share their values. So, let us live the way we choose to live our lives, and LET THEM BE OFFENDED!

I mean, what are they going to do? Crash some more planes in some buildings if we don’t conform exactly to their interpretation of the Coran, when it comes to bathing suits?!?

24 — Anonymous wrote at 7:59 AM on August 20:

If only those brave British soldiers who fought on the Somme or at Arnhem knew what would become of the “Great” Britain they were fighting and dying for.


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