Jesus’ Name Ruled ‘Unconstitutional’

Drew Zahn, World Net Daily, October 28, 2011

A board of county commissioners in North Carolina is asking the Supreme Court for help: Its members don’t believe they should have to forbid volunteers from mentioning the name of Jesus in prayers offered before their meetings.

But the American Civil Liberties Union and Americans United for Separation of Church and State are standing by their victory in a U.S. circuit court decision that states even “a solitary reference to Jesus Christ” in invocations before the Forsyth County Board of Commissioners’ meetings could do “violence to the pluralistic and inclusive values that are a defining feature of American public life.”

Furthermore, wrote Judge James Harvie Wilkinson III in the Fourth Circuit Court of Appeals majority opinion, legislative invocations offered in Jesus’ name are inherently “sectarian” and thus should be censored lest they make some attendees feel “uncomfortable, unwelcome and unwilling to participate in … public affairs.”

But the board disagrees, and with the help ofthe Alliance Defense Fund is asking the Supreme Court to trump Wilkinson’s ruling.

“America’s founders opened public meetings with prayer; this county simply wants to allow its citizens to do the same,” said ADF Senior Counsel David Cortman in a statement. “We trust the U.S. Supreme Court will want to review this case because of the long history in America of offering prayers before public meetings. Public officials shouldn’t be coerced into censoring the prayers of those invited to offer them just because secularist groups don’t like people praying according to their own conscience.”

For years, the board has extended an open invitation to religious leaders from the community to volunteer a prayer before its twice-monthly meetings, asking only that the invocations “not be exploited as an effort to convert others … nor to disparage any faith or belief.”

{snip}

“While legislative prayer has the capacity to solemnize the weighty task of governance … it also has the potential to generate sectarian strife,” Wilkinson reasoned. “Such conflict rends communities and does violence to the pluralistic and inclusive values that are a defining feature of American public life.”

“It is not enough to contend, as the dissent does, that the policy was ‘neutral and proactively inclusive,'” the ruling continues. “Take-all-comers policies that do not discourage sectarian prayer will inevitably favor the majoritarian faith in the community at the expense of religious minorities living therein. This effect creates real burdens on citizens–particularly those who attend meetings only sporadically–for they will have to listen to someone professing religious beliefs that they do not themselves hold.”

{snip}

The court referenced one of its prior decisions in which it ruled a town council’s prayers “clearly ‘advance[d]’ one faith, Christianity, in preference to others … because they ended with a solitary reference to Jesus Christ.”

The ruling further projected, “As our nation becomes more diverse, so also will our faiths. To plant sectarian prayers at the heart of local government is a prescription for religious discord. … In their public pursuits, Americans respect the manifold beliefs of fellow citizens by abjuring sectarianism and embracing more inclusive themes.”

{snip}

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  • Fr. John+

    “even “a solitary reference to Jesus Christ” in invocations before the Forsyth County Board of Commissioners’ meetings could do “violence to the pluralistic and inclusive values that are a defining feature of American public life.”

    They’re absolutely right, of course.

    What no one else will say, however, is that THAT is the reason for speaking the Lord Jesus Christ’s name in a Christian Country (argue with the Supreme Court, not me, for that last one…). ONLY CHRISTIANS have a right to live in a Christian country.

    And the standard antichrists (see above) want to avoid that ‘bowing of the knee’ to Christ… and his Ministers, at any and every opportunity.

    We who ARE Christians, of course, need to overturn this Satania, as the author of ‘Cambria will not yield’ has long noted.

    That that WON’T happen, is also a given…. which is why God is sending freak weather on the most apostate parts of our land- the original 13, who have yet to oust the King that is not even of our blood, from his throne….

  • Anonymous

    “violence to the pluralistic and inclusive values that are a defining feature of American public life.”

    And thus has American public life has become exclusive of everything, pleasing no one.

    The people who founded America would not assent to their snotty descendents invoking THEIR name to make their case.

  • Anonymous

    Sorry but I must agree on this one. IN fact, I’d take it farther. Praying is something to do in private by yourself or in a private group. I don’t want to be forced to hear everyone demonstrating their obsessions with their imagined friends or gods. If one group can do it, freedom of expression says they all can. Just like swearing in public is frowned down upon, so should religious demonstrations.

    And doesn’t Jesus say in the NT that one ought to pray “in a closet,” and that those who make public demonstrations of their faith are actually faithless?

  • Blaak Obongo

    I am a practising Odinist and have been for years. I listen to people professing religious beliefs that I don’t hold day in and day out. And yet mention of Jesus in public prayers has never offended me in the slightest. Christianity is the majority religion in the West, and as long as I’m free to go my own way, I have no problem whatever with that.

    So just exactly who are these “religious minorities” who shrink like vampires from the name of Jesus?

    How about they identify themselves, already.

  • Question Diversity

    “Jesus” is a common first name among Hispanic men. I’m waiting for them to start whining about the “racism” of this sort of thing. Actually, that’s the angle I thought this story would cover when I saw it posted among AR’s stories today.

  • Anonymous

    1 — Fr. John+ wrote at 5:33 PM on November 3:

    “even “a solitary reference to Jesus Christ” in invocations before the Forsyth County Board of Commissioners’ meetings could do “violence to the pluralistic and inclusive values that are a defining feature of American public life.”

    They’re absolutely right, of course.

    What no one else will say, however, is that THAT is the reason for speaking the Lord Jesus Christ’s name in a Christian Country (argue with the Supreme Court, not me, for that last one…). ONLY CHRISTIANS have a right to live in a Christian country.”

    I take it that you are assuming that The United States of America was created as a theocracy? We know that it wasn’t and in fact THE Founding Father, George Washington stopped going to church when he was chided for not coming enough. In our Bill of Rights, NO ONE is to be forced to practice any religion and the government cannot support any particular one. Simply because people who can be at least loosely identified as Christians then and let’s just say also does today, doesn’t mean that this country is a country that was ever meant to be for Christians only. Your assumption that it did or does is merely a good example of the assumption that it was. It is also YOUR JOB to take every advance you can for making your religion, and in your case Vatican Catholicism the ruling party in a theocratic state.

    I don’t care what people want to believe as long as they don’t require me to join in with them. That is also how Thomas Jefferson felt, as is obvious from much of his writing.

    YOu’ve got to face it sometime. The Founding Fathers were deist Christians, nor Catholics or Puritans. George Washington, Benjamin Franklin, and Thomas Jefferson, among many others were Freemasons on top of that. The last thing they’d be for is a theocratic state.

  • Athling

    I know many Amren readers are not Christians. Still, the assault on Christianity, the traditional religion of the West, can be seen by everyone. From Christmas manger scenes to a simple prayer before a football game. The mere mention of the name of Jesus brings wrath and venom from the Diversity Police. The Enforcers of Inclusion have left no stone unturned in their bid to rid the West of all vestiges of Whiteness. This was not always so.

    All of the American founding fathers were either Christians or, like Thomas Jefferson, recognized the civilizing effects of Christianity and approved its application in both the public and private lives of the citizenry.

    The founding fathers would be horrified if they could see where we are today. Not only is the enemy within working feverishly to destroy the Christianized culture of America but even Christianity itself has become a watered down leftist cult-like belief system in many ways.

    Christianity as the founders knew it never believed in the mass immigration, miscegination, and other multicult practices we have today.

    The founders would think a war had been declared on us.

  • Anonymous

    And who exactly are these people to think they get a say in this, at all?

    Christians need to learn to simply ignore stupid people like this. What are they going to do about it? Nothing. That’s what. They have no authority and no power to bring sanctions. So their input amounts to disapproval and nothing more.

    Laugh in their faces.

    And if it ever comes to more than that……well, that’s why we own guns.

  • Athling

    @3

    I totally understand your point. Christianity should not be forced on anyone. For me, this is just another successful attack on the traditional White majority who built this country.

  • TomSwift

    3) Well, life itself doesn’t have a ‘secular’ purpose, so it follows that all issues of morality are inherently religious. You can’t ‘prove’ that it’s wrong to kill someone. What you’d really be doing is banning Christians from praying in public while allowing liberal religions like secular humanitarianism and environmentalism to do as they please. I don’t think it’s fair to allow one religion to do something that the others are banned from.

    Compare the words “Gods/Jesus/Bishops/Priests/Church/Saints/Heretics/Christianity” to the words “Human Rights/MLK/Judges/Teachers/School/Civil Rights Activist/Racists/Democracy” if you dispute that secularism is a religion. In the same manner that Christians use the first, Liberals will use the second set in their documents. (Note: does AmRen allow users to write articles? I would like to argue that Liberals do what they do because they see themselves as enforcing a secular theocracy. This is why anti-racism, like creationism, is immune to reason.)

    Regarding your second point I really don’t know what Jesus said since I’m not terribly religious.

    [Use this link to submit an article. Note the style sheet. http://www.amren.com/forms/submitarticle.html — Moderator]

  • Tim in Indiana

    “As our nation becomes more diverse, so also will our faiths. To plant sectarian prayers at the heart of local government is a prescription for religious discord. …

    Did it ever occur to them that our nation becoming “more diverse” is the real “prescription for discord,” religious and otherwise?

    “Such conflict rends communities and does violence to the pluralistic and inclusive values that are a defining feature of American public life.”

    And where is it written in the Constitution that “pluralistic and inclusive values are the defining features of American public life?”

  • Uniculturalist

    “Providence has given our people the choice of their rulers; and it is the duty – as well as the privilege and interest – in our Christian nation, for our people to select and prefer Christians for their rulers.”

    – John Jay (1745 – 1829)

    Co-author, The Federalist Papers

    First Chief Justice of the United States (1789 – 1794)

  • Anonymous

    Call it irony.

    To make the ruling against uttering the word “Jesus” the board of county commissioners uttered the word “Jesus.”

  • Jack

    Reply to Athling:

    If most of our nation’s Founding Fathers were Christians, then who’s side was God on in the American Revolutionary War?

    In the American Revolution, only one-third of the colonists were on the Patriot side, one third did what they could do to remain neutral, and third of the colonists fought on the Loyalist side, either by serving in a colonial Loyalist regiment, or even the British Army, itself.

    Yes, there were many Christians who fought on the Patriot side because they believed independence for the colonies was the will of God. But a great many of the Loyalists who fought to oppose independence, were also Christians who believed King George to be God’s divinely appointed ruler. These Christian Loyalists opposed separation of America from the British Empire because they believed independence to be contrary to the will of God and “the spirit of anti-Christ.”

    The Loyalists were not evil people, nor were they traitors and villians. But sincere people who bravely fought for what they believed in. As a patriotic American, I admire and respect the Loyalists as noble adversaries, even though they fought for the wrong side. When we celebrate the 4th of July, we should not revile the Loyalists, but honor and salute them as the noble adversaries they really were!

  • Ross

    Reply to Anonymous at 7:26 P.M.:

    The Founding Fathers established, in the First Amendment of the Constitution, our country as a secular nation. In order so that every American can either choose which religion he or she wants to practice, or even choose not to have any religion whatsoever.

    Our Founding Fathers did this because they were aware of such tyrannies as the Inquisition back in Europe, and even the Salem witch trials on our own soil before the founding of our country.

  • Anonymous

    But all faiths have a different prayer system do they not? If you’re too close to a christian prayer then you may be offended, if a Darwinist you may get offended by prayers at all, so if Jesus being mentioned in a prayer and you are close enough to get offended by it then maybe you should go elsewhere.

    I can guarantee as soon as I see a prayer mat facing East (or wherever) I want to either spy on you or get as far away as I can.

  • Anonymous

    what about all the illegal mexicans named Jesus? shouldnt that be allowed and what about all the muslims named mohamed? ditto.

  • eduard

    The banning of using the Holy Trinity’s name in prayer is close to being blasphemous. To whom are you then adressing your prayer. Should’nt they rather ban the blasphemous use of the Holy Trinity’s name in movies etc, so generally misused by the celebrities or actors or whatever these usefull idiots want to call themselves. The rest of the Christian world is fed up with the Amerikwan usefull idiots who are so blasphemous in every second sentence on TV or movies. You don’t find the muslims doing the same thing with their deities, even if their Allah is but the moon god.

  • Alexandra

    #6–Washington had never entered a masonic lodge the last few deceades of his life. Furthermore, he was a Baptist.

    This nation, like it or not, was founded on Biblical principles, the Constitution is based on God’s natural law.

    As far as the manger scene, it’s inaccurate…the shepherds were there when Jesus was born; the wise men (more than three of them, and not even named) came no more than two years later, to the house where He resided with His mother and stepfather.

  • Anonymous

    Even a single mention of diversity can do violence to the traditional values that are a defining feature of American public life.”

  • aj

    I agree with this. We are not a theocracy. People can pray to Jesus in their personal life. It is obnoxious to impose your beliefs on others.

  • LibertarianRealist

    This is a distractive side issue. The forgotten Founding Father, Thomas Paine, wrote a book (The Age of Reason) attacking Christianity. Some Founding Fathers were deists, others were avowed Christians, but they did not create a “Christian nation.”

    Those who regard public recognition of Christianity as an important value can get what they want, I suppose, by voting for Rick Perry and agitating for more Hispanic immigration. Hispanics are more uniformly and more overtly Christian than white Americans and much more so than white Europeans.

  • HH

    I have no problem with this and think may miss the forest for the trees whenever this issue comes up. It is far better to keep things legitimately neutral, ie, non-religious than risk getting to the point where all manner of deities, prophets and mystical beings of who knows what belief system must then be invoked to appease all involved. This is NOT a Christian(or White)country any longer and has NOT been for quite some time. I think some believers are just in denial on this issue. This move began with Jews at least four decades ago, and now must take into account Muslims, Hindu, Bhuddist, Wiccan and anything else you can think of.

    Pretending America is still a “Christian country” because you happen to be Christian is indeed like pretending America is a White country because you are White, despite our numbers haveing shrunk to perhaps 65% of population – and I believe even that figure is entirely optimistic!

  • Anonymous

    “This effect creates real burdens on citizens…for they will have to listen to someone professing religious beliefs that they do not themselves hold.”

    This claim underlies most attacks on White Christian civilization.

    It’s such an unbearable hardship, we’re told, for some people to ever be exposed to an idea or custom they don’t embrace. The mere sight of a manger scene, or the utterance of the word “Christmas” in public, is an offensive burden to these touchy and unforgiving extremists.

    When Whites are finally subject to the Satanic nightmare of Noahide Law (and that’s the goal these lawyers and politicians are working towards), all worship of Christ will be forbidden. “Idolatry” will be a capital offense.

    That’s what these champions of inclusivity are working towards.

  • je suis paganisme

    “And the standard antichrists (see above) want to avoid that ‘bowing of the knee’ to Christ… and his Ministers, at any and every opportunity.” –Father John

    What’s this? Bowing the knee . . . to a minister? Rather would I bow my knee to someone who comes by his living honestly!

    But why don’t Christians just go ahead and pray the way they feel? Why should they tremble before some secular power?

    Let’s see these ministers be an example and stand up for what they believe, and get paid quite well for professing.

  • Hans Schneider

    Christianity means primarily the 10 COMMANDEMENTS which are part and parcel of any white nations laws and customs. So what is wrong with living by the 10 Commandements ? It is our right to be offended by people that do not live by our morals and laws.

  • Anonymous

    I’m going to clear this Founding Fathers thing up right here because (as usual) it is being distorted.

    Did our Founding Fathers intend for this to be a Christian nation? No. The reason why is that much of the population of the US had experienced significant persecution by a so-called Christian nation that was nothing more than Christianity controlled by the state They noticed things in the bible that challenged the state basing its authority on the church, and many swung for it. They did not want a repeat of the matter.

    HOWEVER, our Founding Fathers, obviously, OBVIOUSLY, did not want immigrants and they certainly did not want those immigrants bringing pagan/satanic religions to our country and would have responded by hanging muslims and others. Blacks who tried to practice their dark religions were whipped, then lynched.

    So, Christianity was never meant to be linked to our government or overlap in any way. But ONLY white Christians are supposed to live here.

  • Soprano Fan

    To Hans Schneider:

    Christianity doe NOT mean the Ten Commandments – they were given to the Jews, since, of course Moses predates Jesus. Indeed, a case could be made that Christians are not bound by the Ten Commandments, BECAUSE they were given to the Jews.

    Technically then, Christians are no more required to follow the Ten Commandments than a Hindu should follow the Koran, or a Shintoist follow Scientology.

  • Question Diversity

    To 27 and all those concerned:

    http://goo.gl/kXn1u

  • SS

    Anon #27,

    You should read what My Founding Fathers’ wrote. Ben expected Christianity to be taught in Schools and John Adams and John Hancock said:

    “We recognize No Sovereign but God and no King but Jesus!” – April 18, 1775.

    Alexander Hamilton said two things made America Great: Christianity and a Constitution formed under Christianity. “The Christian Constitutional Society, it’s first object is first: The support of the Christian Religion. Second: The support of The United States.”

    “We have staked the whole future of American Civilization, not upon the power of Government, far from it. We’ve staked the future of all our political institutions upon our capacity…to sustain ourselves according to the Ten Commandments of God.” – James Madison 1778

    What My Founding Fathers’ did not want was for one particular Sect of Christianity to Rule. This does not mean we were not a Christian Nation.

  • Anonymous

    The onslaught against christian civilization and culture continues.

    The U.S. Air Force Academy has pulled out of a Christian-sponsored children’s toy drive after commanders were accused of religious intolerance.

    Mikey Weinstein, an academy graduate who runs the Military Religious Freedom Foundation, said the academy’s participation in Operation Christmas Child is inappropriate because of its evangelical Christian roots.

    Operation Christmas Child is sponsored by Samaritan’s Purse, headed by Franklin Graham — the son of evangelist Billy Graham. It packs toys and other items into shoe boxes and sends them to needy children around the world, along with a Christian message in each gift.

    “This is arrogance beyond measure,” Weinstein told the Colorado Springs Gazette.

    Mikey Weinstein, left, with Air Force Academy cadets in a 2010 photo. The academy backed out of a Christian-sponsored toy drive after Weinstein complained of religious intolerance. (Colorado Springs Cadet)

    Weinstein said he took issue with an announcement about the drive made to cadets in the dining hall, followed up with an email appealing for donations.

    “PLEASE, PLEASE CONSIDER SPENDING SOME OF YOUR VALUABLE TIME AND MONEY TO LOVE ON A KID AROUND THE WORLD!!,” the email said. It was sent by a cadet after approval from a cadet leader, the newspaper reported.

    According to Fox News, Weinstein was first alerted to the drive this week when he received a complaint from a cadet who was offended.

    “The cadet sent an e-mail saying, ‘This just shows how our military is supporting one religion – which is Christianity,’” Weinstein said.

    Weinstein’s Father and Grandfather are both military veterans. His Grandfather begin the anti Christianity in the military effort back in the 1950’s.

    When Mikey was at the air force academy he as plaintiff had the ACLU National Lawyers Guild file lawsuits against any kind of Christian, especially protestant groups on campus.

    He specially disliked protestant cadets who met for bible classes and discussions of Christianity and leading truly christian lives.

    His grandfather, grandfather and now he have been slowly, steadily at the forefront of the program to abolish Christianity in the military for 50 years.

  • margaret

    Americans United for Separation of Church and State is funded by Norman Lear. It’s purpose is to abolish any public expression of Christianity in America.

  • margaret

    The attack on christian westerne civilization continues.

    Executive Branch – POLITICS

    Obama Administration Opposes FDR Prayer at WWII Memorial

    By Todd Starnes

    http://goo.gl/kEfwp

  • dravidian_pride

    Athling wrote:

    I know many Amren readers are not Christians. Still, the assault on Christianity, the traditional religion of the West, can be seen by everyone.

    When did Christianity become a “Western traditional religion”?

    Historically, the traditional religions of the West were Asatru, Religio Romana, Hellenismos, and Druidry.

  • Anonymous

    @27 So, Christianity was never meant to be linked to our government or overlap in any way

    is that why the same Congress that ratified the Constitution had a chaplain and opened with prayers as it does to this day?

    John Adams:: Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.

    Connecticut had state churches up until the 1840s.

    It is pretty obvious they never intended the establishment clause to eradicate Christianity (and lets be honest here, it is ONLY Christianity that suffers attack. Muslim prayer rooms in schools? We’re just accommodating cultural differences. Yoga classes in schools ? A-OK, so what if its tied to Hindu beliefs. Harry Potter in schools? Fine, even though Wiccans say its been great for recruiting. CS Lewis? No WAY!

    The Founding Fathers never wished to eradicate Christianity or ban the mention of Jesus (and believe me that’s what’s coming next, not just in the context of prayer) .. cultural marxists CERTAINLY want to eradicate Christianity and will use whatever excuse that is convenient. Here, it is the first amendment but across the pond they have had similar success despite the fact England has a state church.

  • Anonymous

    #34: Christianity has been a Traditional Western Religion since the Roman Emperor, Constantine, declared it the religion of the Empire.

  • Fr. John+

    “I take it that you are assuming that The United States of America was created as a theocracy? We know that it wasn’t and in fact THE Founding Father, George Washington stopped going to church when he was chided for not coming enough. In our Bill of Rights, NO ONE is to be forced to practice any religion and the government cannot support any particular one.”

    Anonymous- have the cojones to tell the world who you are, instead of hiding behind your bigotry and historical myopia. I just bought a book entitled, “The Chrisitan Life and Character of the Civil Institutions of the United States” by Benjamin F. Morris, recently 2007) reprinted from the original 1864 printing. IF (just saying ‘if’) a book such as this, at over 1000 pages can put your fallacious reading of history to rights, then I would be GLAD to purchase you a copy, and all other diseased minds out there, that will NOT submit to the Facts that America IS, and was constituted a Christian nation. Frankly, I am done with even appealing rationally to such minds, mired as they are in propaganda, and utter lies.

  • Reb Neftali

    # 36,

    Wrong! Christianity is NOT European. No more than a “Hamburger Sandwich” is Asian. Christianity was engendered & augmented by West Asian Jews from the Middle east. Mizrahi Jews ( Jews of the Bible from Moses to Jesus Christ & the Apostles)

    Just because Emperor Constantine declared this Jewish (Asiatic) import as the official religion does not make it any any remote way European. The analogy is similar to Great Britain’s choice of it’s national dish – “Chicken Tikka Masala” – originally of Indian Tandoori cuisine but accidentally accepted and popularised by the British.

  • Anonymous

    John Adams:: Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.”

    —————

    True, poster. The Constitution was also meant for a moral and religious WHITE people only. They did not feel it even necessary to inject the word White, because they assumed EVERY person in the nation at that time understood who they were talking to and about.

    Sad to say, they could never have imagined how their words and documents could be so misconstrued as to include every race under the sun inside this multiracial hell called America today.

  • je suis paganisme

    “I would be GLAD to purchase you a copy, and all other diseased minds out there, that will NOT submit to the Facts that America IS, and was constituted a Christian nation.”–Fr. John

    What’s this, John? First of all you talk about how one must bow the knee to Christ “and His Ministers” (of which, I presume, you are one) and now you say that those who disagree with You have “diseased minds.”

    Are you quite alright?