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The Myth of 90 Percent: Only a Small Fraction of Guns in Mexico Come From US

More news stories on Liberal Myths

William La Jeunesse and Maxim Lott, Fox News, April 2, 2009

You’ve heard this shocking “fact” before—on TV and radio, in newspapers, on the Internet and from the highest politicians in the land: 90 percent of the weapons used to commit crimes in Mexico come from the United States.

—Secretary of State Hillary Clinton said it to reporters on a flight to Mexico City.

—CBS newsman Bob Schieffer referred to it while interviewing President Obama.

—California Sen. Dianne Feinstein said at a Senate hearing: “It is unacceptable to have 90 percent of the guns that are picked up in Mexico and used to shoot judges, police officers and mayors … come from the United States.”

—William Hoover, assistant director for field operations at the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, testified in the House of Representatives that “there is more than enough evidence to indicate that over 90 percent of the firearms that have either been recovered in, or interdicted in transport to Mexico, originated from various sources within the United States.”

There’s just one problem with the 90 percent “statistic” and it’s a big one:

It’s just not true.

In fact, it’s not even close. The fact is, only 17 percent of guns found at Mexican crime scenes have been traced to the U.S.

What’s true, an ATF spokeswoman told FOXNews.com, in a clarification of the statistic used by her own agency’s assistant director, “is that over 90 percent of the traced firearms originate from the U.S.”

But a large percentage of the guns recovered in Mexico do not get sent back to the U.S. for tracing, because it is obvious from their markings that they do not come from the U.S.

{snip}

In 2007-2008, according to ATF Special Agent William Newell, Mexico submitted 11,000 guns to the ATF for tracing. Close to 6,000 were successfully traced—and of those, 90 percent—5,114 to be exact, according to testimony in Congress by William Hoover—were found to have come from the U.S.

But in those same two years, according to the Mexican government, 29,000 guns were recovered at crime scenes.

In other words, 68 percent of the guns that were recovered were never submitted for tracing. And when you weed out the roughly 6,000 guns that could not be traced from the remaining 32 percent, it means 83 percent of the guns found at crime scenes in Mexico could not be traced to the U.S.

So, if not from the U.S., where do they come from? There are a variety of sources:

—The Black Market. Mexico is a virtual arms bazaar, with fragmentation grenades from South Korea, AK-47s from China, and shoulder-fired rocket launchers from Spain, Israel and former Soviet bloc manufacturers.

—Russian crime organizations. Interpol says Russian Mafia groups such as Poldolskaya and Moscow-based Solntsevskaya are actively trafficking drugs and arms in Mexico.

- South America. During the late 1990s, the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia (FARC) established a clandestine arms smuggling and drug trafficking partnership with the Tijuana cartel, according to the Federal Research Division report from the Library of Congress.

—Asia. According to a 2006 Amnesty International Report, China has provided arms to countries in Asia, Africa and Latin America. Chinese assault weapons and Korean explosives have been recovered in Mexico.

—The Mexican Army. More than 150,000 soldiers deserted in the last six years, according to Mexican Congressman Robert Badillo. Many took their weapons with them, including the standard issue M-16 assault rifle made in Belgium.

—Guatemala. U.S. intelligence agencies say traffickers move immigrants, stolen cars, guns and drugs, including most of America’s cocaine, along the porous Mexican-Guatemalan border. On March 27, La Hora, a Guatemalan newspaper, reported that police seized 500 grenades and a load of AK-47s on the border. Police say the cache was transported by a Mexican drug cartel operating out of Ixcan, a border town.

‘These Don’t Come From El Paso’

Ed Head, a firearms instructor in Arizona who spent 24 years with the U.S. Border Patrol, recently displayed an array of weapons considered “assault rifles” that are similar to those recovered in Mexico, but are unavailable for sale in the U.S.

“These kinds of guns—the auto versions of these guns—they are not coming from El Paso,” he said. “They are coming from other sources. They are brought in from Guatemala. They are brought in from places like China. They are being diverted from the military. But you don’t get these guns from the U.S.”

{snip}

The exaggeration of United States “responsibility” for the lawlessness in Mexico extends even beyond the “90-percent” falsehood—and some Second Amendment activists believe it’s designed to promote more restrictive gun-control laws in the U.S.

{snip}

Original article

(Posted on April 17, 2009)

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Comments

1 — Anonymous wrote at 6:59 PM on April 17:

Huh? I just don’t understand.

USA is evil because we send guns to Mexico; they pay us for these guns.

But USA is evil because Mexico sends us drugs and we pay them for these drugs.

Can anybody explain this logic?

2 — SKIP wrote at 7:44 PM on April 17:

90 percent of the weapons used to commit crimes in Mexico come from the United States.
It is unacceptable to have 90 percent of the guns that are picked up in Mexico and used to shoot judges, police officers and mayors

Both statements are pure nonsense. U.S. weapons are not rampant in Mexico, I’ve been there. Mexican Judges, Police officers and Mayors are being killed BECAUSE THEY ENFORCE THE LAWS of the land, as should our own. Most of our own politicians have no honor at all, and loyalty only to themselves and the $$$$

3 — q wrote at 9:37 PM on April 17:

“What’s true, an ATF spokeswoman told FOXNews.com, in a clarification of the statistic used by her own agency’s assistant director, “is that over 90 percent of the traced firearms originate from the U.S.” But a large percentage of the guns recovered in Mexico do not get sent back to the U.S. for tracing, because it is obvious from their markings that they do not come from the U.S.”

Yes, and some of the guns that ARE traced back to the US were purchased by the Mexican government from the US government for their army, and when a Mexican soldier deserts, which is often, he sells his American made weapon to the drug gangs…..or he joins a gang himself and takes his weapon with him.

This evil black preident is fully aware of this, and he has planned all along to try to confiscate our guns by fabricating figures in order to justify his actions.

He also uses himself as a likeable figurehead, remaining above the fray, while his paid minions wail for gun control as they all planned to do in the beginning.

The Clinton type liars are back in office, only this time this bunch is far, far more underhanded than Bill Clinton’s goons, and much more dangerous…..as well as incompetent.

However, I’m pretty sure they’re going to commit some serious errors that could well lose what little credibility they have right now. These edicts DHS issued to the police were childish and very, very foolish, causing mostly whites to unite under a specific purpose against the present administration.

If the tea parties gain in popularity, what we could well have is a battle line drawn in the sand right now. Bill O’Reilly mentioned that the civil war has now begun, referring to the media openly supporting the Obamaites.

I never, ever thought mainstream whitey would ever get up off his butt and be so vehement in protesting this administration. But they did. What happens in the near future is determined by whether or not this tea party crowd was a one time event or a growing movement.

If it IS a genuine ongoing passion, then WATCH OUT America, because it WILL develop into a bitter fight with a sharp delineation between the left and right factions in this country, ignorng party lines. Possibly a third political party could emerge.

The age of liars is upon us again.

4 — ehunter wrote at 10:40 PM on April 17:

Hugo Chavez bought100,000 AK-47s in 2005..the USA tried to block the sale stating that Venezuela already had all the arms it needed for its military. Rumsfeld said that Chavez intended to
either use the weapons to export revolution or fuel drug wars.
In 2006 Chavez went the next step and bought an entire
factory to manufacture AKs from Russia. Now of course these guns
are being manufacutured (without serial numbers) and sold around Latin America to whoever will continue Chavez’s goal of destabilizing the USA.
and that means the drug cartels.

5 — Jack wrote at 3:14 AM on April 18:

In California in the late 1980’s, only a tiny fraction of gun owners registered their weapons when the ban on military styled rifles went into effect. If 65 million American gun owners make clear now to the Elitist Rulers in Washington that they will NOT now…NOT EVER…obey or cooperate with any registration, licensing or ban schemes, the Political Class may get second thoughts about instituting un-Constitutional laws.
What if 65 million gun owners sent post cards from all over the country to the politicians and told them: NO! We will NOT cooperate with your illegal schemes. They will be forced to back off. WE do still have the power…if we use it.
The cards should just be signed, “An American Citizen”. They will only use real names against us. They will know from the thousands of different postmarks that millions and millions of people really have had the last straw and refuse to back up one step more.

6 — macGrath wrote at 4:22 AM on April 18:

O.K. 90 percent of guns and drug money is flowing south from the U.S.and drugs are flowing north. Well let’s finish the border fence. U..hh,we cant do that. We want to let another 30 million mexicans into the U.S. to demographicaly finish off the white race and a fence will prevent our master plan from working. Anybody wonder why there is a fledgling Tax revolt in the wind ?

7 — BW Sam wrote at 3:51 PM on April 18:

I figured from the beginning that this 90% stat had to be, at best, suspect. Go through any gun shop in the U.S. and look at the engravings on the weapons. The majority of them are manufactured outside of the U.S., even the ones by American companies (Chas. Daly made in Phillipines, Stoeger in Brazil, and so on).

Considering the myriad of weapons made outside the States, and the further myriad of countries which participate heavily in the trafficking of practically everything, it never made much sense that a large portion of illegal guns in Mexico were coming through the States, let alone being bought from or through legal American firearms dealers and owners, as the Obama administration is clearly trying to imply.

8 — Buffalogal wrote at 5:39 PM on April 18:

To Q and Jack:

Jack, that is a GREAT idea,. how about giving that idea to the Tea Party crowd and let them run with it?

And Q,. I’ve been stressing big time over what has been going on in this country and I was able to attend a Tea Party on Wednesday. They were all white people. They had a couple officers there, but “dressed down” in kakies and polo shirts, but with their badges on their belts next to their pistols. I was so heartened and wondered how many more people would have attended if they didn’t have to be at a job, as it seemed like mostly retired people there, those who remember what America used to be. One of the speakers choked up at his final summarizing sentence and I saw tears in the crowd. These people know full well what is at stake. We need to keep this up and keep the pressure on, I finally have some hope that all is not lost.

9 — Sardonicus wrote at 6:12 PM on April 18:

I just got back from a local gun show and I can see why the media and our privileged elites hate them so much. The gun show audience was mostly law-abiding white males over forty years old. I didn’t see any Mexicans buying assault rifles. In fact, I didn’t see any Mexicans at all. I saw most people filling out FFL papers for purchases. Dealers were calling the F.B.I Insta-Check and taking drivers licenses. Don’t believe the bunk our “controlled” media tells you. By the way, no RPGs, grenades, or anti-aircraft guns were for sale at the show.

10 — Wild Eyed Charlie wrote at 7:16 PM on April 18:

It’s nice to know that these full-auto assault rifles aren’t really being sent to Mexico from the U.S. Now I can stop wasting all that time and gasoline, driving around looking for those factories in America that produce AK-47’s with Russian and Chinese writing on them.

Out politicians have to be some of the dumbest and/or most evil people on the planet, if they think we’re going to swallow this one.

11 — Jeff Albertson wrote at 10:53 PM on April 18:

Those weapons “traced back” to the U.S., to whom, pray tell. They’re obviously not coming from Bubba’s Gun Shack or any other retail outlet or Homeland Security, the DEA, BATF, FBI, The State Dept., State and local police, HCI and the media would all be there the next day. Someone (sorry I don’t remember the site) speculated recently that many were from weapons supplied to the Mexicans by the USG, as military aid, diverted or stolen. Who knows ain’t saying, but I would be very surprised if any legitimate, federally licensed dealer is ever even indirectly linked to any of these weapons, and it would be child’s play to determine who the manufacturer and wholesaler sent them to.
Now I’m really curious how far back they traced; if their systems are so disconnected or incompatible they can’t even keep track of the info that they already have (which I don’t believe to be the case) or they don’t want to release the info for “reasons of national security”, that is, something that would embarrass or incriminate themselves.
I would like to know the results of the trace. Who were the last Americans to own these guns. “Remington shipped serial # xxxx to U.S. Dept. yyyy on zzz date”. Show me the money, I mean, bill of lading. Put up or shutup, already, Hoover and Co.

12 — GERRY wrote at 1:18 PM on April 19:

This is a good opportunity to turn the left wing media propaganda machine against themselves. So if we are to believe that 90% of the weapons used to commit crimes in Mexico all come from the U.S. then that’s all the more reason to shut down the borders totally. The MSM is in essence if you will pardon the pun “shooting themselves in the foot” with this propaganda and playing right into the hands of all of us that want the borders closed. Good job anti-gun pukes!

13 — Jeff Albertson wrote at 1:45 PM on April 19:

After I commented above, I read in an unrelated article about the pre-existing (to this issue) law that makes it illegal to divulge the trace information EXCEPT for Law Enforcement or National Security purposes, so they get to release the data or not as whatever fits their purposes.

From the NRA
“For more than five years, cities suing the gun industry and anti-gun organizations have sought access to confidential law enforcement data on firearms traces. The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (BATFE) compiles these records when it traces firearms in response to requests from law enforcement agencies.

Every year since 2003, the U.S. Congress has passed increasingly strong language to keep this information confidential. The legislation—a series of “riders” to the appropriations bill that funds BATFE—is widely known as the “Tiahrt Amendment,” after its sponsor, Rep. Todd Tiahrt (R-Kan.).”

Now, putting my tinfoil hat on backwards, I assert that the prohibition on release of data is a good thing unless it is used by the government to avoid proving these allegations, especially if the Tiahart amendment was designed to protect “officers, informants, and other witnesses”, and further, that “every year since 2003”[which is when they probably started sending the weapons], this has been the main purpose of the amendment rather than the protection of innocent gun manufacturers and merchants. Holder & Co are merely playing the cards they have been given, in pursuit of their own goals, but it might be more trouble to pursue this strategy if someone forces the release of the data. Otherwise their assertions are no more valuable than mine.

14 — Lauren wrote at 2:36 PM on April 19:

Even if this 90% assertion WERE true, it would indicate that:

Our borders are too porus.

Every vehicle going over the border (in either direction) must be thoroughly searched, with fees established to pay for those searches

Mexicans have no business in America, and Americans have no business in Mexico.

Mexicans are stealing guns from Americans.

But the 90% statement is just a lie fabricated to facilitate the disarming of the American people. I suspect Obama, at some level, sees himself as the new Chairman Mao, and he plans to send his Youth Army from house to house, searching for our guns (well, YOUR guns. We don’t have one, but are glad YOU do.).

Be prepared to have you home searched, and its contents inventoried. Read about how that was done, early-on, in the homes of Jews in Nazi Germany. Then think of all the advances that have been made, in the fields of data storage, data retrieval, and search devices (they might x-ray your home, just like they SHOULD do with every eighteen-wheeler and shipping container). They may carry live-cams, linked to experts in Washington, who can assess and evaluate everything….down to your books, and the prints hanging on your walls.

Once we’re disarmed, we can expect paramilitary units to show up at our doors, to take our nice things. The units will have no official connection to the government, and the inventory of your home will have been conveniently and coincidentally ‘hacked’.

The internet may be heavily-censored, by then, and Fox News may not be around to warn us. The knock on the door may come as a total surprise.

This will be allowed, even encouraged, because ‘bleeding’,and otherwise dispossessing white Americans is clearly a goal of this administration (already,cuts to Medicare and Social Security are blatant attempts to starve-out the aging whites who voted against the current regime.).

For its role in helping to disarm us, the Mainstream Media should be eliminated from our lives. We subscribe to no paper, buy only ‘society’, ‘garden’ and ‘home’ magazines (no Vanity Fair, since the ‘Africa Issue’), do not have cable, and will soon bid goodbye to network tv. We don’t and won’t have a converter box: so in June, it’s ‘ta ta, FOREVER!’.

I can watch Fox news, on the cardio machines at the gym.

15 — SKIP wrote at 6:31 PM on April 19:

As pointed out by others here and other sites, the government is going to use this alleged weapons transfer to Mexico and the recent assaults on police officers to try to take our weapons away ALL OF OUR WEAPONS. The line will not be drawn at assault type weapons but I’m sure will include handguns of any type/caliber.

16 — Randolph Carter wrote at 6:59 PM on April 19:

I am highly skeptical of this 90% figure. But even if it were true, banning guns in the US will have absolutely zero impact on Mexican gangs. They have plenty of cash to obtain guns on the world black market.

Like many stories in the press, the purpose here is not to report news but rather influence opinion.

17 — sbuffalonative wrote at 10:17 PM on April 19:


We live in an age when facts are irrelevant. What matters is how you feel. If the 90% figure FEELS right and blaming America makes you FEEL good, then it’s all good, as they say.



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