GOP Lawmakers Push to Stop ATF from Asking Gun Buyers About Race

Fox News, April 20, 2015

Congressional Republicans are pushing a bill to block the feds from forcing gun buyers to disclose their race in applications, saying the government should be “color blind” when it comes to the Second Amendment.

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives–ever since changing its background check policy in 2012–has had gun buyers answer questions about race and ethnicity in what’s known as a 4473 application form. Gun dealers who do not disclose the information can be hit with fines and other penalties.

But Reps. Diane Black, R-Tenn., and Ted Poe, R-Texas, want to remove the race and ethnicity lines.

“This intrusive reporting requirement by ATF is nothing more than backdoor gun control,” Black told FoxNews.com in a written statement. “An individual’s race and ethnicity has nothing to do with their ability to safely own a firearm.”

{snip}

The bill was introduced last week and is sitting before the House Judiciary Committee. So far, it has 11 co-sponsors.

{snip}

The ATF, though, defends its policy and says race can be helpful when tracing firearms used in crimes.

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  • Chip Carver

    You can bet the ATF basically wants to track Whites.

    • They were for a while. The program was called “forward tracing”. They did it in the 1990’s, when I had an “03 Curios & Relics” FFL, but I don’t know about now.

      • Deacon Blue

        That’s a real bear of a license to get now. Actually, any FFL is a bear now.
        Where I live, if you want an FFL they supposedly are contacting the local
        police chief to get his/her/its approval first. I wanted one so I could do
        transfers legally for friends looking to buy out of state or to save a little
        money buying direct from other manufacturers {I would not mark
        up a piece I am selling to a friend}. Local LEO gave me hell and told
        me unless I had a place of business selling firearms opened X hours per
        week then he would not sign off on it. The sad thing was that like 8 cops
        on the force would have purchased their non-duty fa’s and ammo from
        me if they had not protested this nonsense.

        • John Smith

          You don’t need approval, you just have to inform them via a letter of your intent to get a C&R. I just send mine to the county sheriff, not the locals.

  • propagandaoftruth

    Not sure about this. The same argument could be used to end crime victim statistics racial breakdowns I suppose, though the current lack of “Hispanic” makes Whites look more crime prone than we are.

    Nonetheless, I certainly don’t trust our governancy.

    • Charles Martel

      It already has when Hispanics commit crime they count as whites.

  • Who knew I’d ever agree with the ATF over Congressional Republicans?

    • Jason Lewis

      What do you think the AFT’s intentions are with this information?

    • Charles Martel

      They might say whites being able to buy guns has a disparate impact because of all the black felons.

  • Luca

    While you’re at it, why not ask gender, sexual orientation and political party affiliation?

    Big Brother wants to know.

    • evilsandmich

      It says something, not very good, about Congress when they can get away with doing something like this to begin with.

      • Sick of it

        Gun registration violates the 2nd Amendment in and of itself.

    • Deacon Blue

      Hey, they make pink hand guns now? And have made pink stocks for AR-15’s
      for a long time too. Now here is the conundrum? What do the anti’s do when
      a trannie, Black, Muslim “person” demands to execute their 2nd Amendment
      Rights? I bet the Progressive’s heads explode.

      • There are already at least several gay gun clubs out there. I think one is(or was) called Pink Pistols. I’m crapping you negative.

        Step back and watch the heads explode!

        • Deacon Blue

          But if we wanted a White hetero-only GC…the answer is of
          course “no” because…freedom of association only applies
          to non-Whites/queers. Hey…so do you think all the fellating fellas at the gay gun club shoot wad cutters out of their pistols?

          Puftas Pistol Palace? I once saw a Ruger 10/22 that had
          some synthetic Hello Kitty stock on it in pink and white.

          Figured some dad put that together for his daughter to teach
          her basic marksmanship. Nope! Asian dude owned it.
          Go figure. Plenty of dads though where i am at who have
          their 16-17 year old daughters plinking away with bright pink
          {and yellow and purple} lower end AKM type stuff from
          Cabella’s. Because putting stickers and glitter paint on your
          neon pink AR-15 absolutely makes the firearm fire better. 🙂

          And there is at least one company – forget who – that does
          a pink revolver in .357 snub which I feel is a useless
          belly gun but if it makes my wife feel at ease with a hand
          gun and less intimidated than carrying a Glock Model 17/19
          then something is better than nothing.

          Back to your gay gun club remarks..

          Unlike my gun club which is drab, spartan and absolutely thrown together for functionality, I bet the gay gun club looks just FAAAAAHHHHHBBBBUUUULLLLLOOOUUUSSSS from an
          interior design perspective.

          I wonder if they have rainbow colored dumb boys to shoot at?

          I wonder what their motto is? Maybe, “The Gay Gun Club,
          No More Concealed Carry, Let Your ‘Gun” Out Of Your Pants
          Holster!” or “The Gay Gun Club…let us show you how to
          properly clean your barrel after shooting your loads!”

          Actually, I am very tolerant of gays. I crack jokes at their
          expense but in reality, if two dudes want to do whatever
          behind closed doors and they are consenting adults?
          None of my business. Just don’t tell me about it or force
          me to watch/participate. Aye?

          • I suspect oddball colors on real firearms would make it more difficult for young children to distinguish them from toys.

        • Deacon Blue

          BTW…my GC banned “human looking paper silhouettes” due
          to the PC anti crowd. We used to have a guy who blew up that
          Bix Nood cartoon and sold them out of his car at the range.

          But someone complained and during the monthly meeting we
          were told that we can shoot at “circular pie plate type paper
          targets” only now.

          A bit of a shame. I miss punching holes into the likeness of
          Bix Nood.

          Of course any images of Magic Negroes stapled to paper plates
          were always a “no no” from Day One.

          • John Smith

            Can you still use B27s?

          • Time for you to find another gun club, it seems. One of my friends once scrounged some life-sized cardboard cut-outs of mimes, so we had a great time shooting at mimes one weekend.

      • It’s possible to anodize aluminum in almost any color.

        • Many of the major firearms manufacturers and parts suppliers are now using stuff like Cerakote and similar products when it comes to a color option for their products. I don’t know if that’s because Type 3 anodizing is more expensive or harder to color or a combination of that or something else.

          I’ve tried to find various small parts and it’s really hard to find the Type 3 that isn’t black. I really wish I had the technical knowledge to work with the stuff and do it right, because I would spend the money on good equipment and start doing everything myself.

          • The only metal finishing on gun parts I did was Parkerization, with dilute, hot phosphoric acid (grey), sometimes with either powdered zinc (green) or manganese dioxide (black). I also sometimes pickled parts in dilute, hot hydrofluoric acid (black), or blued them. Of course, this was all done on steel parts. Fortunately I worked in a laboratory and had access to chemicals at the time, so I frequently brought parts in to work. I never messed with aluminum back in those days.

            As an aside, one current government gripe is the high cost of minting pennies, even out of zinc, relative to the face value of the coins. I have repeatedly suggested minting them out of aluminum in order to save money. The Japanese one-Yen coin is worth approximately the same as a US penny, and is aluminum. Aluminum US pennies could be anodized a nice copper color, so they’d look the same as our current versions. Almost nobody ever listens to me.

  • Jason Lewis

    Guess they want to be able to say 95% of gun purchaces are by YT.

  • Tannenbaum

    It’s no secret that few blacks or mestizos obtain their firearms by going to a gun shop and filling out the legal paperwork. And so the Imperial goverment is fully aware that these “statistics” can and will be used to “prove” that only Evil White People have guns, and are using them to Oppress wymminandminorities.

    We may take it for granted that anything the Imperium does is anti-White by definition.

  • Hilis Hatki

    I have no problem telling them Iam Chinese-Mexican-American.

    • Speedy Steve

      White Hispanic

      • Mangosteen, $1000 chair

        Native American, since I am native to America.

        • Speedy Steve

          Asian, as in Cock-Asian!

    • When the older versions of the 4473 form had a “fill-in” blank, instead of “check-off” boxes, I often used “Celt” as the race-descriptor. I hope this gave some government drone with a GED a headache.

    • ekwaykway

      So is it egg rolls, burritos or McDonald’s for supper?

      • Hilis Hatki

        I just started making my own eggrolls from scratch. They are called eggroll because egg is in the batter, new to me . So Iam making my own themed eggroll. A homemade hotpocket. Mexican eggrolls, Italian , a burger eggroll sounds good.
        I use to joke that the way America is headed Iam changing my name to Pepe Wong. May have to add Muhammad in there.

        • ekwaykway

          Wow, you’re making me hungry. Great post!

        • I have long used egg roll wraps for making deep-fried chile rellenos, instead of rolling the stuffed chile peppers in batter and then pan-frying them.

  • dd121

    Good ole’ Republicans don’t want whites to have any advantage. Our heroes.

  • propagandaoftruth

    Gun ownership by White America is the only thing that prevents us from Euro style political repression, I say.

    When a Brit of a Frenchy tweets an off color joke about Nelson Mandela, the Euro-Marxists fear not some “nut with a gun” responding to force with force.

    Here they do. Thank God and the NRA.

    • LHathaway

      We have to remain vigilant, or the government could take over?

      • propagandaoftruth

        Take over more. Yes, 300,000,000 guns in non-gubbamint hands serves as some kind of a restraint to gubbamint obnoxiousness.

  • Vito Powers

    There they go again. Another suckup, excuse me, “outreach” to minorities by gutless Republicans. Look, people of color, we Republicans just want a color blind society like our mutual hero, Martin Luther King, did. Please, people of color minorities, consider voting for us Republicans.

    • ElComadreja

      They’re having a race to the bottom over who loves these black b****rds more.

  • Speedy Steve

    I like Tom T of Georgia, and have been watching his vids for several years now. I guess that means I’m not a racist after all.

    • InAFreeCountry

      I will have to check this guy out, he is talking a lot of sense for a black dude. I watch Tommy Sotomayor sometimes also, he points out a lot of the degeneracy and ignorance in the black community and gets a lot of hate from blacks because of it.
      I am not racist either, there is a small percentage of blacks on the right hand side of the bell curve that I don’t have a problem with.

  • I recently filled out a 4473 form and gladly checked off Caucasian. Why would I care about having to fill out a box on race when I already have to fill in the boxes asking for my full name, date of birth and address?

    Will Republicans next be asking federal entities that keep track of crime statistics to remove any references to race and ethnicity?

    • Deacon Blue

      That’s not gonna happen {short barreled rifles and suppressors removed from
      NFA and the “tax” stamp penalty you pay}. I don’t know why they want to collect
      racial info but considering its the ATF’ers the reason can not inure to your benefit
      or mine. Personally, I think the 4473 is a bit of a sham anyhow {show me anyone
      who is willingly go to check off the “mental” box when they are looking to buy
      a firearm}.

      • I just don’t see anything nefarious being implemented that wasn’t already in place with the forms that are required to be filled out. I agree that much of the language, rationale and red tape of the ATF and similar agencies is idiotic and intrusive, and I certainly don’t trust the tentacles of government bureaucracy; but having to answer a question about my race is way down on the list of things I’d like to remove.

      • “Mental illness” isn’t a genuine medical diagnosis anyway.

  • Lexonaut

    “The ATF, though, defends its policy and says race can be helpful when tracing firearms used in crimes.”

    Nascent dictatorships are always interested in things that make government’s job easier. As a nation we’ve lost the interest in smacking down government intrusions simply because they are infringements on personal and business freedom, regardless of the supposed benefits.

    What a shame, this used to be a great country.

    • John Smith

      “A policeman’s job is only easy in a police state.”

      • Lexonaut

        I say. Extremely well played.

  • LexiconD1

    I bought three Smith and Wesson 9mm in 2014. I had to buy them in 90 day increments, pass a handgun safety test, give them my serial number for my safe (or buy locks. I bought the locks, I’m not giving them anymore information than what is required), and give them TWO forms of ID with my address on them. Plus fill out forms for my background check. To which I replied, “I had less hassle getting my nursing license, and those fingerprints were Federal”.

    CA sucks.

    But….In all the times I went into the gun shop, it was always crowded, I never ever saw one black in it. I saw one hispanic, and he was wearing a military uniform (and left without buying anything.)

    • Good lord! Why do freedom loving White people still live in CA?

      • LexiconD1

        Well for me, I’m a native. Most of my family lives here. But, I’m leaving when my son graduates high school next year. I think my parents will eventually follow me.

        • phillyguy

          What a shame that you have to leave the land of your birth.

  • Mr. L

    I thought race was a social construct.

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      • Mack0

        Does he think we’re black!

    • I saved a bit over four dollars on groceries by clipping coupons last week. Ask me how!

  • Those are called “straw man” purchases, and are quite illegal, even if no later crime is committed with the firearm(s) in question.

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