Sharia Courts ‘As Consensual as Rape’, House of Lords Told

John Bingham, Telegraph (London), October 20, 2012

Muslim women in Britain are being forced to “live in fear” because of the spread of unofficial and unregulated sharia courts enforcing Islamic rules, the House of Lords was told.

Rulings by informal religious “councils” and tribunals are sometimes no more “consensual” than rape, peers were told.

The warnings came in the first ever full Parliamentary debate on the subject in the UK.

Baroness Cox, the independent peer and Third World campaigner, last year tabled a private member’s bill in the Lords setting out plans to rein in a network of unofficial self-styled “courts” which apply Islamic principles.

One study estimated that there are around 85 Sharia bodies operating in Britain, although there is no official estimate.

They include legally recognised arbitration tribunals, set up primarily to resolve financial disputes using Islamic legal principles but which have taken on a wider range of cases.

There is also a network of informal Sharia “councils”, often operating out of mosques, dealing with religious divorces and even child custody matters in line with Islamic teaching.

The bill, which had its first full debate yesterday, would make it a criminal offence for such bodies to style themselves as courts or those chairing them to pose as judges.

It would also limit the activities of arbitration tribunals and explicitly require them to uphold equality laws including women’s rights.

Baroness Cox told the House of cases she had encountered including a woman who had been admitted to hospital by her violent husband who had left her for another woman but still denied her a religious divorce so she could remarry.

Another woman was forced to travel to Jordan to seek permission to remarry from a seven-year-old boy whom she had never met because she had no other male relatives, she said.

A third who came to see her was so scared of being seen going in that she hid behind a tree whole another told her: “I feel betrayed by Britain, I came to this country to get away from all this but the situation is worse here than in my country of origin.”

Baroness Cox said: “These examples are just the tip of an iceberg as many women live in fear, so intimidated by family and community that they dare not speak out or ask for help.”

Meanwhile Baroness Donaghy added: “The definition of mutuality is sometimes being stretched to such limits that a women is said to consent to a process when in practice, because of a language barrier, huge cultural or family pressure, ignorance of the law, a misplaced faith in the system or a threat of complete isolation, that mutuality is as consensual as rape.”

Lord Carlile, the legal expert, was among those backing the bill but the Bishop of Manchester urged caution arguing that it could end up “stigmatising those individuals in communities it is aiming to help”.

And Baroness Uddin, the first female Muslim peer, said it would be viewed as “another assault on Muslims”.

Lord Kalms, the businessman, claimed that self-styled Sharia courts had already reached far beyond mediation to areas such as criminal law.

“To my knowledge, none of these cases has ever received police attention or investigation, and this is a scandal for which the police, among other authorities, must be held responsible,” he said.

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  • FourFooted_Messiah

    And this is why “One Law for All” is the only way to go in a sane, secular democratic society.

    No, we don’t care about your weird relgious ways.  A woman married to a seven-year old boy?  Yeah, I can see that, in Islam.  It was also the subject of a movie called “Holy Matrimony”, involving Hutterites.  Both have weird ways that aren’t needed in a modern society.   Let them claim their own land (and I wish the Canadian government would export all the polygamist Bountiful BC Mormons back to Utah, where they belong.)

    No special treatment just because you have some weird delusion about fairies in the sky.

    Period.
     

    • Spartan24708

      She wasn’t married to the kid he was her nearest male relative and since the backward and antiquated Islamic system has made half the human race perpetually children she had to ask a first grader to allow her to get a divorce.

      • FourFooted_Messiah

         I fail to see much of a difference.

  • http://jewamongyou.wordpress.com/ Reuben H

    On the flip side, the British “justice” system is a joke. It’s very possible that Sharia would be a better alternative in many cases. Violent criminals might actually be punished instead of getting the slap on the wrist they get now.

    http://www.jewamongyou.wordpress.com

    • FourFooted_Messiah

      Well, yes, but I can’t condone their overharsh punishments for many things. I mean, come on, a woman gets shot in the head for adultery in a society where men’s “needs ” are considered paramount?  No.

      I once met a Palestinain taxi driver in Toronto who talked about the nasty things his son did – including using Dad’s credit card to do some betting.  He said that in “his country” the kid would get his hand cut off.

      I don’t see where that would help anything.  A One-handed person has a harder time getting a job, and really, if I got my hand cut off for stealing bread because I was hungry, yeah, I’d be bitter and would start killing humankind just for spite.

      Granted, bread is different than betting, but it still doesn’t warrant body parts being lopped off. Sufficient (as in LIFE) jail time would do for the gambler. As for the bread-stealer, well, why should anyone have to steal bread in the first place?

      • IstvanIN

         Life imprisonment for gambling is a bit over the top, don’t you think?

        • FourFooted_Messiah

           Well, a few years for theft (of his father’s credit card) probably might suffice.

          But we have such weak sentences here …a “life” sentence would be cut down to a few months anyway.  /sarc

    • http://www.facebook.com/franklin.ward.10 Franklin Ward

      You cannot be serious.  It is impossible to have “a little” Sharia law.  I am surprised that in Britain the people are putting up with even considering Sharia.  We need a constitional amendment in the U. S. to ensure that our courts never try to adopt this nonsense, especially if the Anointe One is re-elected.

      • The__Bobster

        Anyone who proposes such a law gets mocked by libtards and the MSM.

      • Spartan24708

        The worst thing would be a person who wants to leave Islam would possibly be turned over to Islamic authorities for execution.

      • mobilebay

        It was probably that nutty Prince Charles that invited them. He can always hide out in one of the castles and let his subjects face the muslim music. By the way, I think Sharia law has been used in this (US) country a few times.

        • IstvanIN

           The Prince of Wales, typical of his generation, is very liberal, but has no political say so whatsoever.  I sometimes wonder, though,  if things would have been allowed to deteriorate so much if his mother did?

  • FourFooted_Messiah

     Agreed.  If the UK had stuck to its secular democratic guns, then NO religious courts would get a second thought.  NONE of them would be allowed, not Islamic, nor Cathlic nor Jew, as should be.

    One Law for All.

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/7RORAJVG7LJJZECDJIILHJBE7U So CAL Snowman

     Of course blame the White host country and NOT your disgusting, backwards people and culture. 

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/7RORAJVG7LJJZECDJIILHJBE7U So CAL Snowman

    IF they want to live under Islamic rule with Sharia law there are plenty of Muslim countries to choose from, but I doubt they have the social benefits and standard of living that the UK has.  Basically they want to live like savages on OUR dime.  It will end eventually when the money rivers dry up, and right now we are in the worst drought ever.

  • IKantunderstand

    OMG. Nobody cares. Great Britain is officially non- existant. Moslem Baronesses? Are you kidding? Things are worse in G.B. than back in the old country? I would say so. And by the way, it’s not G.B., it’s not language barriers. It’s the religion and willingly allowing yourself to be taken over by these mongrel Islamic hordes. What did you expect? White people (the ENGLISH) have completely allowed themselves to be backed into a corner. Don’t worry, I’m completely certain King Mo I will watch out for you (if there are any of you left, that is), when the time comes. No more Corgis at Buckingham Palace, or any place in the realm when good ole King Mo I takes over! Enjoy your Meccashire pudding!

  • ViktorNN

    The first mistake England made was allowing so many non-white immigrants in. The next mistake was allowing Muslim immigrants in. Combined in the form of one unpleasant group of people, Brits have really fouled their own nest. It won’t end pretty and there’s no guarantee that whites will win.

    • http://twitter.com/Herceg Der Man

      Is it different in USA with the mexicans and blacks?

      • Sherman_McCoy

        No.

      • ViktorNN

        Nope. Same basic problem. But thankfully we don’t have nearly as many muslims as blacks and mexicans. 

      • Carney3

        I’d say Muslims are worse than Mexicans or blacks, yes.  Mexicans and blacks aren’t trying to force you into a primitive cult.  Oh, you’ll have to do the ritual kowtowing on MLK day or the Mexican equivalent, but for the most part as long as you’re being taxed and your kids are pushed aside for theirs in college admissions etc that’s all they want from you.  The Muslims want to invade every aspect of your life down to what your women wear and do.

  • Sherman_McCoy

    No, it is the white people of England who have been betrayed.

    • Sun

      Have they? Because I blame white people. 

      Liberals/Leftist/Labour started this trend and dialectic where minorities think it is acceptable to even hold these attitudes.I blame white Liberals above any foreign immigrant. They are the reason this has started in the first place and continue to do so. They are the ones who made it acceptable to have Sharia controlled zones under the guise of multiculturalism.It is like blaming the kids for stealing out of the cookie jar and not blaming the mother who has started this entire trend.At least I can, for argument sake, understand that Muslims are doing what they would naturally be inclined to do (just like any group). Who can blame them?If I went to the Middle East with a large group of European people, we would naturally set up our own microscopic society.What is the excuse for Anglo Saxons in Britain who are left wing? They want to feel “noble?” They want hedonism that comes from such minor benefits of diversity? If so, why just not personally move instead of transforming the whole native society?  There is a thing called the “plane.” It is a fascinating invention. Get a ticket and go where you want (assuming they have an airport). In fact, I encourage it. It widens your perspectives about the world.That is a hard pill for you to swallow but not all whites are great. I blame white Labour for creating this mess and the white Tories for not having a spine to stand up in the face of any hysteria. I blame all.

      P.S. It shouldn’t be a “discussion” or “negotiation,” which what this has dissolved into. It should be:

      When in Rome, do as the Romans do.

      If not.

      Then get out of Rome. End of discussion.

      • Sherman_McCoy

        Sigh.  Of COURSE they were betrayed by whites.  Liberal leftist cultural Marxists who had a deliberate policy of flooding the nation with unassimilable third-worlders for the specific purpose of destroying the Tories.  

        Of course these parasites should not have been imported in the first place.  Of course they should go back to their pest holes.I’m going to go out on a limb here and guess that english is not your mother tongue.  Subtlety seems to be lost on you.

  • rightrightright

    “And Baroness Uddin, the first female Muslim peer, said it would be viewed as “another assault on Muslims”.”
    Wrong, no matter how much you whine for the victim slot.  Sharia courts are an assault on democracy and the rule of law, our law.

    Here is Paul Weston, leader of British Freedom Party, polishing off a hostile leftwing interviewer on the subject of Islam.   He makes the point that our laws have become “sharia compliant”:
    http://www.barenakedislam.com/2012/10/30/absolute-must-see-paul-weston-leader-of-the-british-freedom-party-takes-on-a-truly-hostile-left-wing-journalist-and-triumphs-magnificently/

  • Whirlwinder

    Well, the camel has its nose in the tent. Get ready for Islamic armageddon. You have lost your first love and have traded it for socialism. This lead to diversity and multiculturalism. And now you have an elite leadership class that regards you as cannon fodder. With no elections and no elected leader how can you protect yourselves and rid yourselves of the immigrant nightmare?

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100002454802929 John Smith

    The ones who should be screaming about betrayal are the White native born British who have been betrayed by their government. Sorry to say, I think they have OD’d on the Koolaid and are farther gone than their liberal counterparts on this side of the pond.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100002454802929 John Smith

    Personally, I’d really like to see some Chinese style justice in this country. You know, government officials executed for corruption  and taking bribes and kickbacks.

  • Carney3

    I object to the term “British Muslims” used in the homepage in AR’s subtitle / summary / commentary on this article.  There are no British Muslims.   There are Muslims in Britain.  At most there are Muslims with British citizenship.  That’s all.