Vogue Italy Launches All-Black Issue
She insists racism has nothing to do with it, but admits the world of fashion has a predilection for Eastern European models with their “blonde hair and long legs.”
“Of course they are very beautiful, but they also kind of look all alike,” said Franca Sozzani, editor of the magazine, Vogue Italia.
During her 20 years in charge of style-bible Vogue’s Italian edition, Sozzani has earned a reputation for a culture-savvy take on cutting-edge elegance.
In the past, Vogue Italia has focused on topics the fashion industry, it would seem, prefers to ignore, including the growing use of plastic surgery.
Few however, were prepared for Sozzani’s most audacious move to date: the July 2008 issue of her magazine which features a cast exclusively made up of black models, including actors and music industry stars.
The idea, Sozzani told Deutsche Presse-Agentur DPA in a recent interview, first took shape a year ago during a conversation with supermodel Naomi Campbell, one of the few non-white models who has managed to emerge and dominate the catwalk over the last decade.
“Then I was in the US for Super Tuesday,” she said, referring to the Democratic Party presidential primary showdown in February.
The event catapulted black candidate Barack Obama ahead of the then favourite, Hillary Clinton, and into the spot of top contender.
“We saw something was changing, so we said, ‘why don’t we try to do the same?’” Sozzani explained.
Stressing however, that US politics was not the only source of inspiration, she added: “There was also the wish to offer space to another type of beauty.”
Back in Milan, Sozzani set about transforming her American dream into reality with the help of celebrity photographer Steven Meisel, known for his work with Madonna in the 1992 book Sex.
Established supermodels including Alek Wek, Iman, Tyra Banks and Campbell were chosen, along with emerging faces like Jourdan Dunn.
Their images and those of others grace the 170 pages of the magazine which goes on sale next week in Italy and abroad.
Still, while American voters may be ready for a black president, are magazine buyers in Italy, or elsewhere for that matter, drawn, to pictures of non-white models?
British-born Campbell, a former girlfriend of Italian Formula One manager Flavio Briatore, enjoys diva-like status in Italy, but in Milan as in New York, London and Paris, black models a rarely seen on the catwalk. They are rarer still on magazine covers.
A long-held view in marketing circles is that advertising agency clients are reluctant to associate their products with non-white models for fear of alienating affluent consumers in the West. Campbell has been vocal in claiming that black models face growing discrimination.
In 2007, she repeatedly accused the British edition of Vogue of subscribing to the view that non-white models don’t sell, and revealed that she made the cover of French Vogue, only after the late designer Yves Saint Laurent had threatened to break off relations with the magazine unless it featured her.
“A precise choice like this one always has its risks,” Sozzano told DPA of her decision to publish Vogue Italia’s “all-black” issue.
“People can like it or they can hate it. I personally think they will like it … Obama’s ‘wave’ has also been felt over here.”
(Posted on June 30, 2008)
Comments
One of things I like about white beauty is that we come in all shades.
Our skin is white, pale, pinkish, olive-skinned, yellow-toned.
Our eyes are: blue, green, brown, grey, hazel.
Our hair color is blond, brown, black, red.
Our hair texture is curly, straight, wavy, choppy.
We are very unique and the most attractive people on earth. We don’t need “special issues.”
Posted by Bennie at 6:43 PM on June 30
Who cares? The magazines will no doubt be back to all-white models next issue. This is just a publicity stunt.
Posted by at 7:09 PM on June 30
“She insists racism has nothing to do with it, but admits the world of fashion has a predilection for Eastern European models with their “blonde hair and long legs.”
“Of course they are very beautiful, but they also kind of look all alike,” said Franca Sozzani, editor of the magazine, Vogue Italia.”
This sounds like a variation on what White people say about black men, they all look alike, and there’s a great deal of truth to it.
If your in the business of making money and your clients prefer Eastern European women, then what’s the problem? Fashion designers want models to make their merchandise look good. Why are you trying to force something on people that’s not their idea of beauty?
Posted by at 7:16 PM on June 30
Send them a message loud and clear that your not interested in their “Women of the Bush” series and cancel your subscription and tell them why.
Posted by at 7:18 PM on June 30
This one ought to be a real hot seller..
Nothing “racist” about it, people simply do not find black women all that attractive. End of story.
Posted by David at 8:05 PM on June 30
The pushing has already began and he hasn’t even been elected yet. Most don’t understand the changes we will see if a black man in elected in any white country.I’m sure there’s many whites that can tell you how it benifited them by having Mugabe as a ruler over them.Most haven’t even thought far enough ahead to imagine what it will do to our country when he fills many rolls of the government with affirmative action blacks.Then you have McCain who would be a great president for a foreign country but a traitor to this one. We are in a pickle.
Posted by Billy at 8:34 PM on June 30
“Of course they are very beautiful, but they also kind of look all alike”
Actually, that was the original intent of models. Essentially, there were meant to be walking hangers. They weren’t supposed to be seen; the clothes were. The appearance of the ‘super model’ only came about in the 60’s.
Of course non-white women look different. Compared to being surround by the same type of white women, non-white would stand out. How this works for the fashion industry is yet to be written.
Posted by sbuffalonative at 8:41 PM on June 30
Just don’t buy the magazine. Advertisers will get the message real fast.
Posted by at 8:55 PM on June 30
What a strange thing to say, “whites look all alike” when in actuality the white race is the most diverse of all the races when it comes to hair color, eye color, hair type, skin shades, sizes and shapes. Ignorance continues to bloom everywhere.
Posted by john drake at 8:57 PM on June 30
>>>“Of course they are very beautiful, but they also kind of look all alike,”
Then again, maybe that’s what the READERS are interested in. What will be interesting is how well financially, the magazine will do. I doubt very many White women will buy it. I mean what RATIONAL White woman wants to look and dress like an African? What rational White man would want his White wife or girlfriend LOOK even remotely like a Black female?
Posted by Fed Up at 9:09 PM on June 30
Making an edition of Vogue exclusively featuring black women might make the diversity fanatics who own the magazine happy at first, but when they see a huge loss in revenue due to such an idiotic decision, they won’t be smiling anymore.
In my opinion, the decision to make an all-black edition of Vogue is just as stupid and irresponsible as Absolut Vodka carrying out an ad campaign in Mexico featuring the American South West as part of Mexico.
Will these diversity fanatics in the business world ever learn that marketing diversity is irresponsible and financially detrimental?
Posted by at 9:17 PM on June 30
White women’s hair comes in many different textures and colors.
Black women’s hair only naturally comes in black only in either nappy, “straight ironed” or “cotton candy”. White women’s eyes range from blue to green to hazel to brown to grey.
Black women’s eyes are mostly brown with usually yellow tinged sclera. Now who looks all alike?
Posted by at 9:34 PM on June 30
Doesn’t anybody see what is going on?
There is a movement afoot…a global movement…to replace, supplant, overthrow, whatever you want to call it… the white order in Europe and North America. It is being done under the cover of entertainment, art, fashion, and music.
Black is beautiful. White is evil. Black music is the voice of the opppressed. White music is teeny bopper or hillbilly. Blacks are put in position of power in our movies and television shows (Marine drill sergeants, Police captains, judges, Presidents, even God [Morgan Freeman])
And now all whites look the same according to this so-called fashion editor. Apparently a billion people with the same color eyes, skin, and hair look different all of a sudden.
It is all a form of subliminal brainwashing. Get the white people to shut up by calling them racists every second for the past 50 years. Then make them look stupid in every movie, tv show, and commercial compared to their black counterparts. And finally tell them how ugly they are. And now the white people have such low self esteem that they are willing to vote a black in as President over a more qualified white candidate in the US, and surrender their countries to black migrants from Africa in Europe.
Focusing on the Vogue models over the larger issue of Black empowerment by white liberals will only end in disaster eventually. Maybe sooner than we think.
Posted by Martel at 10:44 PM on June 30
If I am looking to buy something in terms of clothing, I would prefer to look at a magazine with people like me. Why is it so important to have people who don’t look like me? If I am a buyer, I want to see the clothes I want on someone who looks like me, and guess what, so do blacks! They have their own magazines for their own fashions. I don’t mind a black person, but making a whole issue and making a big thing about it does bother me.
I say DON’T buy from the sponsors in the mag!
If fact, I think one of us should put up a web site targeting these racist against white people magazine’s sponsors.
Posted by american outside at 10:54 PM on June 30
Darker skin simply does not photograph as well as light skin. Dark skin aborbs, rather than reflects light. And even with modernized special lighting techniques, the subjects skin will not photograph as luminously as light skin. Special care has to be taken to prevent a glaring sheen from showing up on the mid portion of their face. And when it comes to advertising cosmetics, makeup will not stand out as much against the darker backdrop, one reason why when black women are used to endorse cosmetics, they usually select lighter skinned blacks like Halle Berry. Using them to pitch hair care products not intended for blacks, is also tricky. A couple of years back, Beyonce was hired to endorse hair color. Only problem was, her long flowing locks for which she is famous for, are lacefront wigs made of European hair. So their using her as a celebrity spokesmodel was false advertising at it’s finest.
Posted by at 11:01 PM on June 30
*Stressing however, that US politics was not the only source of inspiration, she added: “There was also the wish to offer space to another type of beauty*
The fact still remains that the high-priced designer garments shown on the runway, are aimed at wealthy white women. The same is true of most Vogue readers, which not only show high end fashion, but have high-end advertisers like Cartier and Gucci.
Since their main market is white women, it only makes sense that they have always used mostly white models when pitching their products. The idea is to allow the woman to fantasize how a given outfit might look on her, albeit on younger, taller more idelized version of herself. Pure fantasy yes, but fantasy has it’s limits. They can push for more and more black models, in their effort to convey the message that black is beautuful, but they can’t force white women to go out and buy the magazines, or the mechandise. And money is always the bottom line in the fashion industry, not politics.
Posted by at 3:52 AM on July 1
It’s a private magazine and she or anyone has the right to feature whom they please. Of course magazines depend on revenue from the people who buy them. If it’s financially feasible to have blacks, then fine but if not, she’ll go back to whites. It’s not about race but about money and what sells. I do think people, regardless of race, tend to buy what they identify with.
Posted by at 4:58 AM on July 1
“She insists racism has nothing to do with it, but admits the world of fashion has a predilection for Eastern European models with their “blonde hair and long legs.”
— — — — —
This statement (kind of odd, but quite true) was once true for Western Europe as well — before it was invaded by the Third World during the past half century. Now it’s considered that these types are unique to Eastern Europe … simply because that area has not experienced the invasion yet.
So this is a frank admission that “the world of fashion has a predilection” for these types and that it has to go to Eastern Europe now in order to find them. This special black issue is just a concession to show that they’re not prejudiced and that they’re fighting racism. Yeah, sure! But she already admitted that the fashion world prefers the “Eastern European type” (formerly known as the European type).
Oh, and it’s interesting too to see the unexpected and far-reaching influence that Obama is already having on the world — even reaching to the high-fashion industry in Milan! I’m sure we’ll be seeing much more if this, especially if he gets elected.
Posted by browser at 6:26 AM on July 1
It’s interesting as the people of Italy move further to the right in their recent election, the privileged media elite moves further toward diversity and multiculturalism. I suspect this is another American import that indirectly promotes the “great dream” of the elimination of racism through miscegenation.
Posted by Sardonicus at 7:43 AM on July 1
Why would a white Italian be interested in an all black issue of Vogue? Odds are, only black immigrant females living there will be snapping it up. However, most of them will never be able to afford the merchandise the magazine will pitching inside.
Posted by at 8:08 AM on July 1
When was the last time you saw a short fat woman working as a model. The only reason models tend to look alike is because those are the standards set by the industry. So instead of blond women with long legs they will have black women with long legs and as many white features as possible ( big deal). I’m willing to bet you want see any of those black women with a butt two ax handles wide on the cover. They will still all look the same just a shade darker.
Posted by Daniel at 9:21 AM on July 1
“In my opinion, the decision to make an all-black edition of Vogue is just as stupid and irresponsible as Absolut Vodka carrying out an ad campaign in Mexico featuring the American South West as part of Mexico.
Will these diversity fanatics in the business world ever learn that marketing diversity is irresponsible and financially detrimental?”
———————————————————————————-
They will learn when the people with discretionary income to spend on these items quit buying their products and they lose revenue. We need to hurt them in the pocketbook. This will do more good than all the yelling in the world, the bottom line is all that matters to them.
Posted by at 9:26 AM on July 1
White women’s hair comes in many different textures and colors.
Black women’s hair only comes in black only in nappy, straight ironed or “cotton candy”.
—————————————————————
All very true, but black women have slipped into denial about that these days. Visit any black forum, and you will invariably find the topic of hair discussed at length. And without fail, countless black females will boldly state that their hair comes in all different textures including stick straight. And they also claim this happens without racial mixing no less. This denial stems from the fact that the majority of them have been wearing weaves since they were introduced back in the 80’s. Many black women not only think they can hoodwink whites into believing they can have naturally straight or wavy hair and be full black, but they also try and fool each other into believing it. Of course, few of them can explain why you can’t find a picture anywhere of a black female taken from the 70’s and earlier who had straight hair that wasn’t obviously pressed or permed into shape. Few would also care to explain why back in 60’s ,and 70’s, they referred to an afro as the “natural” Since today they will not even admit that their natural texture is wooly.
Posted by at 1:50 PM on July 1
Sounds like a good way to run a magazine into the ground. Give the people what they want, and what they want are white models and white beauty. We are the Beautiful People, and we are the standard for beauty around the globe.
Posted by at 2:15 PM on July 1
There’s far more diversity of appearance within the European race than any other continental-level race. It’s not even a contest.
So if this airhead has a point, maybe it’s because all the beautiful women these fashion types see look alike…because these fashion types are selecting the same types of women.
I notice a lot of rather masculine looking women in fashion. Might have something to do with all the homosexual males doing the choosing.
I also notice that as soon as diversity becomes a criterion, other criteria (like beauty) tend to fall down the list in importance.
All black women look alike to me, at least to a far greater degree than white women. No redheads, no blondes, no brunettes, no blue eyes, no green eyes, no hazel eyes, no straight hair, no wavy hair…
Posted by Svigor at 3:59 PM on July 1
This is stupid. The article about beauty contest winners was also bad. When it’s best, Amren manages to counter what has been taken for granted. When it’s worst, it’s like a compilation of how many stupid ideas, stupid people from all over the globe can think of.
Posted by Wichmann at 4:33 PM on July 1
What was it that Eldridge Cleaver wrote in his “Soul on Ice;” - “I’d jump over ten black b****es to get to one white woman.”
Posted by at 7:03 PM on July 1
I just hope these models have some self esteem and pride in their race that they’ll shun the high end designer gowns for hoodies, jump suits and other FUBU accessories. Keep it authentically black.
Posted by at 7:26 PM on July 1
“Why would a white Italian be interested in an all black issue of Vogue? Odds are, only black immigrant females living there will be snapping it up. However, most of them will never be able to afford the merchandise the magazine will pitching inside.”
Blacks in Rome are economic refugees picked up off the coast of Lampedusa. Fashion is the last thing on their minds and most don’t speak Italian. This isn’t about catering to some non-existent niche market.
Posted by at 7:49 PM on July 1
“Why would a white Italian be interested in an all black issue of Vogue?”
The answer is they wouldn’t ordinarily. But the more Blackness is pushed down their throats by the folks who control the media the more White Europeans lose their racial identity. Look at it this way; The more non-whites are depicted in the media, the less Whites feel like they’re in charge-even in their own countries in Europe. It’s one of the ways they break down our collective racial identity. The more Blacks and other non-Whites are displayed the more demoralized we become. Eventually they will win if White don’t take a stand against this.
Posted by Awakened at 9:58 PM on July 1
As I am reading through these comments I find them all very amusing. I guess I shouldnt be as surprised as I am.
It’s interesting to see people inquire, why would an Italian want to see an all black issue? The politics over there are very different than here in America. Actually, the idea of race means much less to them, or at least thats the way it seemed last time I was there.
Its weird how people are taking so much offense at the editors comments that the white models look alike. People from other races have heard that for years, and then finally someone says it about white women and its such a big deal. Its not like she said white people were ugly. I dont think there’s anything wrong with the statement. And yes, white people have more a variety when it comes to hair texture and eye color. But shades of skin? That just doesnt make any sense. Black people come in shades from as light as Beyonce to as dark as Naomi Campbell.
The bitterness in people’s comments about Barack Obama is also quite interesting. It just goes to show that its about time for some change. I dont really think the issue is completely necessary, but the fact that people are so threatened by an all black issue of a historically white magazine, or a half-Black President of a predominantly white country, says alot about our politcs.
Yes, it is all, indeed, very amusing.
Obama 08!
Black IS Beautiful.
Posted by Jeannette at 5:23 PM on July 2
“The politics over there are very different than here in America. Actually, the idea of race means much less to them, or at least thats the way it seemed last time I was there.”
I’ve been to Italy a couple of times myself and blond, blue eyed Northern Italians don’t consider anyone living south of Naples to be real Italians. Talk about a racial divide even amongst their own citizens! Don’t try to lecture people on here about something you know nothing about.
Jeanette, Obama is just a fad, one that will fade out of people’s minds after the election. I would love to see you come back to this board in November, if only to hear you vent your rage. One other thing, black IS beautiful IF YOUR BLACK.
Posted by at 8:23 PM on July 2
I said the idea of race means less to them, I never said anything about who they considered REAL ITALIANS. Im sure most of the people who migrate to Italy from other contries dont consider themselves real Italians either, so that is completely irrelevant.
And about me venting rage in November, it is very doubtful that that will happen. One, because Obama will most liekly be president. And two, because I dont vent my rage?? Especially not to the narrow minded:)
Like I said before, this is just comical.
Posted by Jeanette at 9:51 PM on July 2
Reply to Jeanette;
If its all so “comical” why do you keep going to the time and trouble to post on this site? Surely a successful and sophisticated black women like yourself must have more worthy pursuits?
Posted by at 10:25 PM on July 2
To Jeanette: “…Black people come in shades from as light like Beyance to as dark Naomi Campbell.” Blacks have to thank whites for that.
Posted by ALEX II at 10:59 PM on July 2
Jeannette might give fifth-grade English another try before presuming to lecture anyone on anything. It is interesting how often blacks think Obama will remedy every black grievance, no matter how delusional or counterfactual. What is he going to do, institute a 21-century version of the Intolerable Acts and house federal Sensitivity Monitors in every white American home, so that evil whites won’t say anything derogatory about blacks?
Posted by Cassiodorus at 11:49 PM on July 2
Having read the comments posted, I am amazed at how insecure and threaten whites feels. The comments such as:
“Women of the Bush” series,
“There is a movement afoot…a global movement…to replace, supplant, overthrow, whatever you want to call it… the white order in Europe and North America. It is being done under the cover of entertainment, art, fashion, and music,”
only highlight the insecurity that whites feel.
Posted by at 1:39 AM on July 3
Oh, and for the record, I think it’d be absolutely amazing if America would vote a Black person into the White House. But my attraction to him is more about him being a Democrat than being a person of color. I voted for Hillary.
Posted by Jeanette at 1:39 AM on July 3
Jeanette, comparing Naomi Campbell to Beyonce, in an effort to show how blacks come in more variety in terms of skin tone is rather ridiculous. Beyonce’s light skinned Mother, has always been very prideful of her Creole ancestry. Which almost always mean French blood, and can also suggest Spanish and Native American ancestry as well.
Using blacks with obvious mixed blood is silly. In Africa this is not the case. While it can be argued that Ethiopians have a different phenotype then people from Kenya. If look at a group of Africans from any given country, and compare them with a group of Europeans from any given country, Europeans will always show much more variety in terms of appearance. Just compare these Nigerians who are all more or less, the same shade, with similiar features—
http://www.iowaworkforce.org/centers/nigeria.htm
To this small group of Germans—
http://www.josetaboada.com/fotos/fotosmiami2/germans.JPG
The Germans have a much more diverse look about them. This is true of virtually all European countries.
Posted by at 8:46 AM on July 3
Having read the comments posted, I am amazed at how insecure and threaten whites feels. The comments such as:
“Women of the Bush” series,
“There is a movement afoot…a global movement…to replace, supplant, overthrow, whatever you want to call it… the white order in Europe and North America. It is being done under the cover of entertainment, art, fashion, and music,”
only highlight the insecurity that whites feel.
And they have been quite successful, haven’t they? Especially in the area of music. For the last 20+ years rap and hiphop have dominated the music business. And that is why I rarely have my radio on anymore. And I used to be a major fan of mainstream music. Call it insecurity if you like, but I am no fan of black culture, and wan’t no part of it.
Posted by at 10:49 AM on July 3
“There is a movement afoot…a global movement…to replace, supplant, overthrow, whatever you want to call it… the white order in Europe and North America. It is being done under the cover of entertainment, art, fashion, and music,” …
only highlight the insecurity that whites feel.
Posted by at 1:39 AM
——————-
Yes, there is, Anonymous! And with good cause. But this is not due to you or your people. The subversion is from within. After all, your people do now own magazines like Vogue or control the “entertainment, art, fashion and music industries”. But the the fact of subversion is still there nonetheless.We are not worried about you. You are just being used as tools.
Posted by at 2:32 PM on July 3
“And about me venting rage in November, it is very doubtful that that will happen. One, because Obama will most liekly be president. And two, because I dont vent my rage?? Especially not to the narrow minded.
Fortunately, the decision of who will be President won’t be made by you or any other black but rests squarely on the shoulders of White American voters. Ciao.
Posted by at 6:14 PM on July 3
“Oh, and for the record, I think it’d be absolutely amazing if America would vote a Black person into the White House. But my attraction to him is more about him being a Democrat than being a person of color. I voted for Hillary.”
C’mon Jeanette, girl, don’t put your game face on. We all know the score. It’s all about race.
Posted by at 7:14 PM on July 3
“The politics over there are very different than here in America. Actually, the idea of race means much less to them, or at least thats the way it seemed last time I was there.”
Of course politics vary from country to country. I also find it very naive when people compare different countries in regards to race because the racial dynamics of countries are different. Obviously, race isn’t going to be an issue in countries that are racially homogenous. As such, race didn’t mean much to them(italians), because unlike the US, italians didn’t have racial diversity, thus no understanding or experience with it, so it wasn’t an issue. That has indeed changed today, as italians are now having a lot of illegal african and muslim immigration. As such, the italians are not liking it one bit and want immigration of non-whites to stop.
I do agree that people are overreacting a bit here to an all-black model shoot. A magazine can do as it pleases and it’s the sales market that determines what will succeed or not. An all-black model shoot may succeed with italians because it may seem “exotic” to them. Americans are much more exposed to blacks and thus used to them so there is no “exotic” appeal.
Posted by kc at 7:37 PM on July 3
“As I am reading through these comments I find them all very amusing. I guess I shouldnt be as surprised as I am.”
Why would you be surprised at all? People have been saying these things about black’s appearances, work ethics, crime rate, intelligence, etc. for decades, no make that centuries. This is old hat and the most damaging thing is it’s true. What amuses me is how some black people will go to boards like this and act so innocent and naive (while publicly and privately spewing their own anti-White hatred).
Posted by at 8:07 PM on July 4
There are black magazines which have had nothing but blacks in them for decades. Why do they have to be given such “pride of place” in a European fashion magazine? It’s sickening—even my 12 year old friend’s daughter asked why there are so many blacks in magazines, when blacks have their own. Why can’t we have white-only fashion magazines.
Italians are some of the most gorgeous people on earth, for crying out loud. They range from olive skinned brunettes in the south to blonds in the north. They are golden in complexion, and often delicate in features. The most exquisitely handsome man I have ever seen was a policeman in Florence, with wavy dark hair and green eyes and a face that could have been painted by Raphael. A mag full of nothing but blacks? In Italy? WHY?
Blacks have been appearing in all kinds of unlikely roles—space scientists leading command control; brilliant lawyers; doctors who save the day on ER. Except rapist and murderers of whites. They are NEVER portrayed in films as rapists or murderers of whites, despite tens of thousands of these interracial crimes occurring every year.
Posted by cybell at 8:33 PM on July 4
I remember seeing a cover of either Vogue or Bazaar several years ago featuring a young black woman… sad to say, but she looked exactly like Idi Amin…
P.S. I wonder why liberals are so infatuated with blacks….
Posted by Muggy at 10:42 AM on July 5
Blacks have low self esteem. They don’t value anything unless Whites give value to it for them. Blacks need to learn to appreciate their own black beauty instead of trying to force it on Whites or worse, trying to compete with European women. What makes someone attractive is largely genetic. You can cover the fuzz with blonde polyester wigs but it looks unnatural. I used to think black women were fat because of too many trips to KFC but I’ve seen specials on TV displaying black African women as being just as big as American ones. It’s genetic and no amount of dieting will reduce it. If you remember, there used to be a black celebrity on the Jenny Craig commercials who pretty much stayed the same during her run on them and then she dropped off the radar.
Posted by at 9:56 PM on July 5
As an Italian I would like to correct the mistaken view expressed by some here, that there is a racial divide between Italians.
There is NO such thing as different races of Italians.
Of course blue eyes are more common in the North than they are in the South. But the difference is not big enough that you can talk about difference races. In fact, if you look at an individual Italian, there’s no way you can tell which part of Italy he’s from.
There are many Southern Italians who have blond hair. My late great-aunt was Sicilian and she was blonde with blue eyes. In the US there’s an actor called Vincent Gallo, he’s a pure-bred Sicilian and he has blue eyes.
On the other hand, look at the current premier, Silvio Berlusconi. He’s from Milan, one of the northernmost cities of Italy, and he looks very dark-haired and Mediterranean.
There is some rivalry between Northern and Southern Italians. It’s based on cultural difference, not racial difference. Also, this rivalry is quite soft, nothing like the bitter white-black divide in the US.
A good analogy for the rivalry between Northern and Southern Italy, is Scotland and England. They are different white cultures that have a lot in common and live in the same nation, and there may be some slight animosity because in the past one conquered the other, but otherwise they get along well.
Posted by Caballaria at 1:02 AM on July 6
It’s true that many blacks feel a need to compete with whites, especially in the area of attractiveness. Actually, they often feel need to prove they can not just compete with, but attact any non-black ethnic group. When it comes to boasting off their race, they mainly like to zero-in on what they believe makes them so irresistable, and it isn’t their education, or social skills, and so on. What they usually brag about, is their imagined sexual desirablity. The men will talk endlessly about the size of their male anatomy, and the women will brag about their big round backsides, as though no man can resist them for it. Many times they sound almost delusional in their egocentric beliefs that they are so sexually appealing to other groups, but they repeat this so often amongst themselves, that most have grown to believe it.
Posted by at 2:19 PM on July 6
“Also, this rivalry is quite soft, nothing like the bitter white-black divide in the US.”
However, now that Italy or other european countries have had or are having different races and ethnic groups, such as muslims and blacks, it is very bitter and divides, more so than the US blacks/whites.
Posted by at 8:35 AM on July 7
re:Cabellaria-“There is some rivalry between Northern and Southern Italians. It’s based on cultural difference, not racial difference. Also, this rivalry is quite soft, nothing like the bitter white-black divide in the US”
Being Italian, you’re probably around few blacks so have little understanding. However in the US(or in any country with a larger black population) it is the behavior of blacks that causes other races, not just whites, to seperate themselves. Blacks, in larger numbers cause massive crime, turn any area they live in into a slum, are irresponsible and use welfare at high rates, cause mayhem and behave badly. Anyone, whether they are white, asian or whatever must seperate from blacks wherever they are around in large numbers.
Posted by at 9:25 AM on July 7
White women’s hair comes in many different textures and colors, true, but Black women, particularly models from different parts of the world, also have hair in different textures and colors. There are millions of blacks with naturally wavy, curly, or non-nappy hair, although of course straight hair is not common except in individuals from the Americas (specifically Latin America). You may say this diversity comes from admixture and you may be right, but in some groups (particularly the African groups) mixture is ancient and of no consequence anymore, much like the mixture of North Africans and Middle Easterners among Europeans, which added to the “natural” diversity of Europeans.
In Britain, France, and North America, with its western European-mixed populations, you can find Black models with lighter eyes and hair. Sure, they are not “pure Black”, but they are Black. I say that to say, Blacks are also diverse and there is a “type” for every taste, but I agree that this issue is for publicity. It will sell well, but the trend will not last. People will continue to favor Eastern European and occasionally Brazilian models; they have the unique set of features that are preferred.
Posted by Kapers at 12:30 PM on July 9
Who told you that you are beautiful? Your white parents. I am black. My black parents told me I am beautiful, so does my WHITE husband of 8 years!Our daughter is a combination of us both, so what would you like to tell her, that half of her is pretty and half of her is not? Regardless of what society tells us, we all have an obligation and a right to oursleves to be beautiful no matter what our race, eye color or hair texture.
What white woman wants to buy a magazine full of black women? What black woman wants to but a magazine full of white women? It’s a magazine People! You have made it into a race war!Vogue is a FASHION magazine, people of all races have an interest. So if a magazine like Vogue has taken initiative to devote an entire issue to beautiful black models, why is there a problem? The world has changed but not that much. Don’t worry so much, the next issue will once again feauture mostly white models. I wonder what you blondes would argue if Vogue featured all red heads, another minority in the industry. Or geez, an all Asian issue.
It seems that a lot of you are afraid of change, a single issue of change. You suggest that because you are white, therefore you are the best and anything other than white is not worthy of your time.
You are not the best. You are just as beautiful,and just as ugly as all other races in the world.
“Nothing “racist” about it, people simply do not find black women all that attractive. End of story.” True, and other people simply don’t find white women all that attractive. End of yet another story.
It’s a magazine. If you don’t wnat to buy this issue, then don’t buy it. Vogue is not going to go under because a few narrow minded people think it absurd to feature an all-other-than-white-models-with-the-exception-of-4 issue. It’s a big deal for us black women, to flip through pages and see people who look like US in a magazine such as Vogue. It would be great if American Vogue had been the issue, but be that as it may. It is a historical moment in the world of fashion. So complain all you feel you need to, the issue is out there.
Posted by at 2:49 PM on July 10
“Who told you that you are beautiful? Your white parents. I am black. My black parents told me I am beautiful, so does my WHITE husband of 8 years!Our daughter is a combination of us both, so what would you like to tell her, that half of her is pretty and half of her is not? Regardless of what society tells us, we all have an obligation and a right to oursleves to be beautiful no matter what our race, eye color or hair texture.”
Oh, here we go again, another black female poster who claims to have one of those rare White husbands. If black is so beautiful, why not marry a black guy and produce a pure sista? Is it because you find White more attractive than black?
“It seems that a lot of you are afraid of change, a single issue of change. You suggest that because you are white, therefore you are the best and anything other than white is not worthy of your time.”
The issue is why we have to be forced to look at something we don’t think is attractive. This goes back to the post on self-esteem. Why is our opinion of what’s beautiful and what’s not so important you? We don’t care whether there aren’t any White woman in Essence and we certainly don’t care about your opinions of us.
“Nothing “racist” about it, people simply do not find black women all that attractive. End of story.” True, and other people simply don’t find white women all that attractive. End of yet another story.”
Not quite. People all over the world find light skinned Caucasian features to be the standard of beauty whether it’s in Mexico, Equador, North Africa, India, the Middle East, etc. There isn’t one country outside of subsaharan Africa that thinks black women are the standard for beauty.
“It’s a big deal for us black women, to flip through pages and see people who look like US in a magazine such as Vogue.”
What’s wrong with Jet or Ebony or any of those other rags that feature people like you? Is it because Vogue is White and White is better?
Posted by at 11:29 PM on July 10
i was going through and reading all of the comments and in some ways i agreed with things everyone is saying and in someways i do not. I think this issue is a stepping stone i think that the whole idea that people are now trying to say all blacks look alike is very obsurd. We are all different shades, shapes, and sizes. For instance my sister has very light skin almost as light as some darker whites or light hispanics my skin is more of a brown im not dark skinned but im not light either. And our hair is different i have i guess what some people would call usual black people hair and yes its thick and like wool and i perm it for manageablity my sister on the other hand has very long wavy hair. And mind you we have the same parents. and both my parents are black. And for whoever said we have white people to thank for our different shades of skins or eyes or whatever i think that is stupid. because people now that have both parents that are black and their grand parents and even great grand parents that were all black are still turning up with different eyes hair and skin. so before then when raced was mixed it wasnt by choice majority of the time so why should we be thanking them. I do agree white people look different and so do black people. we do not look the same. and i think hey if you dont want to buy the issue dont buy it but obviously the editor is trying to make a point and just by all of these comments clearly he has!
proud of my light eyes brown skin & nappy hair!!!
Julia!
Posted by Julia at 2:59 PM on July 12
The standard of beauty varies from each individual asked. However in the world of modeling it seems that most of the black models who are successful or considered ‘exotic’ are the ones who are from Africa: tall, slim, coarse hair and very dark skin. The African American model however, who has features resulting from a multi-racial background rarely sees success unless she has a ‘different’ quality. Tyra Banks was an example. She has since retired but her career took off as she had a new look: green eyes and larger breasts, fuller hips. I am of various Native American tribes, Irish and African. Because my skin is brown I am considered ‘black’ but would not yield the same results in modeling as would my dark-skinned Nigerian counterpart. So in comparison an African model is the standard of black beauty in the world of fashion vs the African American model who, by her features obviously has white ancestry.
Some people do look alike, which is true of all races. There are beauties and beasts of all races, all skin colors. Instead of suggesting that this issue is a waste of your time, why not take a chance and open your eyes to a new perspective?
Have you seen all black models to say that you will find them unattractive? Can you just look at the color of someone’s arm, without ever seeing their faces and bodies determine such person is going to be ugly to you?Is every blonde, brunette or red head you see attractive? We identify with members of our own race but to exclude others from being considered attractive based soley on their skin is seemingly ancient.
Posted by at 3:51 PM on July 13
Judging someone by the color of their skin is wrong, attractive or unattractive debate, it’s wrong…..
I am black and I understand how non-blacks label black people as lazy,ignorant, sexually motivated, etc. It’s due greatly to the fact that many black people in the media, especially with the explosion of reality television, disrespect other black people. We call each other the n word, b***ch, ‘ho’ in our music, on television and film, and on public streets- all for the rest of the world to see. It’s emabarrassing and shameful for those of us today who do respect one another, and it’s disrespectful to our grandparents and so on who were victims of slavery and various forms of racial cruelty. those were the blacks who had a real struggle, a real fight to endure.
I am not suggesting that black people don’t have a struggle today, we do. we have to work twice as hard for equal recognition. That being said, I don’t feel I am owed a free pass by anyone. I spent years of my childhood in a low-class neighborhood, had cockroaches, criminals probably living right next door. I went to school, studied, did my homework, graduated and am now staring my own business. My parents were teenage parents, they did not use that as an excuse to seek welfare or to remain in the bowels of America blaming others for their problems. My parents worked hard, kept me and my siblings fed, clothed, happy and loved. It was hard for them but slowly, steadily they continued college, working to make a better life for us. We were taught to be the best we can be, to do the best we can, do respect ourselves and each other. This is the Black America that the world does not see. The doctors, scientists, CEO’s, etc, who worked hard, kept themselves on a path no matter how difficult it may or may not have been.
Instead the world sees blacks with 7 kids, jobless, on welfare, raping, stealing, killing, hurting each other.It’s not who I am, nor the black people I assocaiate with, but it is what the world sees.
Of course there are whites who are commiting the same crimes,and in the same social status, in the white ghetto. High-school dropouts, drug lords, child molesters, etc. We see the rise in white male and female prison inmates.Still the white community doesn’t show their aggression toward one another the way the black community does.
I wouldn’t change my race. I am me and because of a strong family I love myself, despite the reflection and assumptions of others that I shouldn’t.I am proud of my acomplishments and of the choices I make. I don’t forget my role on America. Growing up I’d hear “go back to Africa!”- I didn’t come from Africa, I’ve never been to Africa. The irony in that is that although hurt extends from a decendant of slavery, I wouldn’t want to live in Africa. America is my culture, my home.
Stereotypes exist, and if we feed them others will believe them. I respect everyone’s opions but I don’t take it personally as you don’t me. I am black, my boyfriend is Italian, my best friend is Japanese, my favorite band is The Doors, my favorite actor is Don Cheadle,my favorite movie is Imitation of Life.
Posted by C at 4:42 PM on July 13