Comments
Yes, I agree with Jonah Goldberg. But he’s first in line to denounce any white people who want to address the race problem in the way it seems he wants it addressed.
Posted by Question Diversity at 6:09 PM on March 25
I choose Jared Taylor as one of the representatives of my race when this “race conversation” takes place.
Any takers?
Posted by at 6:10 PM on March 25
These feeble attempts at accurately addressing the issue honestly are comical.
Posted by Robert Kelly at 6:42 PM on March 25
There are two parties in a conversation. When certain people are not allowed to talk there is no conversation. Whites are prevented from saying what they want to say by the threat of being called “racist”. There is no conversation. If they let us talk, they will hear things they don’t want to hear, and have to change their ways.
Posted by at 6:55 PM on March 25
My observation is that when the conversation turns to race; the only people allowed to talk are the blacks and hispanics.If a white man opens his mouth with any dissent he’s labeled a bigoted racist xenophobic piece of trash and immediately shutdown.
These groups have had a free ride for decades and it appears there is no end in sight.
Posted by at 7:14 PM on March 25
“This sort of disconnect between rhetoric and reality is the kind of thing one finds in novels by Alexander Solzhenitsyn or Milan Kundera.”
The only disconnect being bridged here is the one between the LA Times and their vanishing readers. Too late though. They’d be better served convincing blacks and hispanics about the importance of buying newspapers.
Posted by Dr. Smith at 7:31 PM on March 25
We all know this, so let’s not dwell on it.
We tried to talk for years and were spurned every time, just like Mr. Goldberg said. Now the time for talk is over.
Too bad…
Tom Iron…
Posted by Tom Iron... at 7:47 PM on March 25
When a presumably Jewish writer publishes such candor in the notoriously liberal Los Angeles Times, I believe we’re reaching a crossroads. The pendulum is beginning to swing, folks.
Posted by Slappy at 7:54 PM on March 25
We don’t need a conversation about race. It will always be biased in favor of the blacks. (Our government will never stop catering to them.)
It’s ironic that they think they can act tough to try to scare some whites on the streets. But, when it comes to forming any dialogue to support their side of the argument; they get their feelings hurt by the truth of examples, history, and what can be seen with the naked eye. They won’t be open-minded. They’ll always have slavery as an excuse to fall back on. They’ll always feel held down by the white man.
Posted by at 8:05 PM on March 25
A little ironic coming from Jonah Goldberg, who throws the term around himself and has used it against Samuel Francis many times.
Posted by Joe at 8:11 PM on March 25
Johah Goldberg? LA Times? Who’d have thunk it possible? Before you know it Jared Taylor will be as mainstream as Oprah!
Posted by Flaxen-headed Strumpet at 8:12 PM on March 25
Yeah… there will never be a dialogue on race as long as whites know they can be fired for having the wrong opinion.
Posted by WaitNow at 8:27 PM on March 25
We all remember Pres. Clinton’s National Diaglogue on Race, don’t we? This is where hand picked, invitation only meetings were held in several states. Interestingly enough, only blacks, other minorities, and self flagulating white people were invited to these conclaves. Eventually the whole thing was dismissed as the joke it was, and everyone went home.
Posted by greg at 8:54 PM on March 25
I suppose before this upcoming election is over, whites who don’t vote for Obama will be labeled as racist, particularly those who don’t agree with the black explanation for black failure. There is no conversation about race, only indoctrination. I happen to love my race enough to where I’m not going to be a lemming and follow the rest of the milquetoast pasty white liberals over the cliff just to be polite. Blacks have been in our faces for the last 40 years. It’s about time we stood up and got in theirs and held them accountable for their words, deed, and actions.
Posted by UnPC at 9:01 PM on March 25
Jonah Goldberg? Double speak. I agree with the above poster who calls Jonah on his hypocrisy. Samuel Francis was a good man and people like Jonah and Bill Buckley demonized him. I will never trust someone like Jonah Goldberg. He’s out to make a few bucks, is all.
Posted by at 10:30 PM on March 25
An honest discussion on race = shut up and listen to my grievences, then you BETTER tell me what YOU PEOPLE are gonna do about them, or else!
Posted by Ray Cist at 10:32 PM on March 25
I thought race was a ‘social construct’? Should we talk about the ‘social construct’ that is failing, and the ‘social construct’ that is, or was working the best?
Posted by at 10:46 PM on March 25
The only disconnect being bridged here is the one between the LA Times and their vanishing readers. Too late though. They’d be better served convincing blacks and hispanics about the importance of buying newspapers.
Amen brother. The hemorrhaging readership and viewership of the old media as whites abandon them in droves for the internet is sweet, sweet revenge.
Posted by qwerty at 10:54 PM on March 25
Jonah Goldberg is a neoconservative. He’s all for open borders, multiculturalism and he’s all for American interventionalism at the behest of powerful (and mostly ethnic) lobbies in Washington.
Posted by Tim at 10:56 PM on March 25
The only true FREEDOM OF SPEECH exists here with American Renaissance. Here, we can express not only our opinions, but state the FACTS as we live them every day.
The only plus I see of having someone like Jonah Goldberg express thoughts on race is that it may be the beginning of real freedom of speech. Do we dare to hope?
Posted by ABC at 11:13 PM on March 25
I’ve been reading a couple books recently about the collapse of the Soviet Union. “Glastnost”, meaning speaking truthfully and openly about issues, destroyed the USSR. A regime built on lies could not withstand honest public criticism. That goes for the USSA too.
Posted by Schoolteacher at 9:55 AM on March 26
Here in Britain our politicians have been saying for ages that what we need is, “An open and honest debate about immigration…” And then of course, as you can well imagine, anyone who dares to express himself honestly and openly is immediately castigated if he fails to spout the usual received wisdom.
Posted by stephen at 10:48 AM on March 26
Who is Janet Murguia? Oh, she’s just the president of a group called the National Council of La Raza, which—despite what they’ll tell you—means “the race.” In fact, doesn’t it seem like the majority of people begging for a “new conversation” on race are the same folks who shout “racist!” at anyone who disagrees with them?
Not only that, but these are the same people that call whites racist, advocate displacing us and killing us…YET we “need to talk about the race issue”.
Furthermore, as someone else pointed out, why is it that liberals talk about race being a “social construct” then insist on having discussions on “race” and all of these “racial diversity programs”? God, liberals are conflicted!
Posted by at 10:57 AM on March 26
Hey ABC,, not so fast, I have tried to post many times to AmRen, and I guess my remarks were too inflammatory for the site. So, not so fast on the free speech. I wasn’t using foul language, I was just pointing the finger where it needed to be pointed. I am a white nationalist, so it would appear I am not welcome to post here. I will be watching to see if this gets posted, it probably won’t. So much for free speech.
Posted by at 11:28 AM on March 26
“But for others—like La Raza or the college professors scrambling to follow Obama’s lead—when they say we need more conversation, they really mean their version of reality should win the day. Substitute “conversation” with “instruction” and you’ll have a better sense of where these people are coming from and where they want their “dialogue” to take us.”
Once this fact is grasped, Liberal arguments lose all steam.
All their talk of equality and brotherhood is really a code for revenge on and dominance of White (or other successful) people.
If asthetics alone differentiated the races, Whites would still be the most sought after. In reality, we also think longer and plan better than non-Whites. It may be comforting to believe that your lower status is accidental. A couple moments of real competition however, will change your mind.
As long as there is life in my body I will never submit to the demands of overgrown children who pretend to be equal.
You are out gunned, out thought and out planned. You are ugly even to yourselves. How’s that for opening a “dialogue” on race?
Posted by True Resistance at 11:45 AM on March 26
“I’ve been reading a couple books recently about the collapse of the Soviet Union. “Glastnost”, meaning speaking truthfully and openly about issues, destroyed the USSR. A regime built on lies could not withstand honest public criticism. That goes for the USSA too. “
Posted by Schoolteacher at 9:55 AM on March 26
> Excellent comment from Schoolteacher! This goes for every sort of movement. And so it goes for the white seperatist movement as well. We must not forget to be healthy in our self criticisms lest we become the liars we abhor.
Posted by Whiteplight at 1:23 PM on March 26
“Jonah Goldberg is a neoconservative. He’s all for open borders, multiculturalism and he’s all for American interventionalism at the behest of powerful (and mostly ethnic) lobbies in Washington.”
Posted by Tim at 10:56 PM on March 25
> We ought to be careful about defining people. If a liberal writes an article that agrees with us, we ought to encourage it rather than attempt to confine them in a box that we define for them. How else do we expect to gain recruits? And we need recruits - just look at the handful of habitual posters on Amren and realize how small this community really is….
Posted by Whiteplight at 1:26 PM on March 26
The media’s drumbeat for Obama as a racial healer is profoundly dishonest. Whatever other qualities he has, he severely lacks the ability to propose some kind of discussion on race. We know because at the Democratic convention in 2004, he bandied on about “acting white,” never once apologizing for using in public such a hateful term designed to smother our European American diversity.
Then last week it all came tumbling out: “white resentments” and “typical white person.” At last Obama’s mind is revealed — he thinks the diverse white American peoples share only one emotion (“resentments”) and have no diversity in thinking, talking, and working….we’re just “typical.”
This is a much stronger indictment of Obama than it appears at first glance. It has been a multicultural rule for the last 20 years that any European American would have serious problems for using “typical black person” or “typical Asian person” or “typical Latino person.” He has to know that the formulation of the coded phrase itself has been characterized as fundamental racism…so what’s with his tin ear, or is it a deeper malaise that wrestles with his soul?
Posted by Bill at 2:10 PM on March 26
Goldberg is playing games. As mentioned above, he’s first in line to demonize whites. Sure, he’ll talk about race, act as if he’s being open, and try and work things to blame whites for all problems (unless they’re gay or neocons or Jewish or media hucksters) encountered by nonwhites.
Posted by They are hypocrites at 2:42 PM on March 26
This open honest discussion on race will no more take place than an open honest discussion of the validity of god.
Posted by Robert at 4:14 PM on March 26
Honest discussion does happen on the internet.
Among college professors, politicians, journalists, and TV pundits you seldom hear an honest discussion.
Posted by at 5:04 PM on March 26
The heck with conversation. Let’s strive for separation. Total and complete. Heaven on earth. Never going to happen but it’s a nice dream.
Posted by BettaFish at 5:06 PM on March 26
Let’s talk about race; up is down, logic is crazy talk, and black is a fairer color than white, success is bad, and planning is racist. I would rather have a confab with the mad hatter from Alice in Wonderland.
Posted by Lars at 6:57 PM on March 26
When Blacks want a conversation on race it always turns into a monologue, with them setting the terms of the debate. They define racism in such a way that they aren’t racist due to their lack of power and Whites are racist because they have the power in the hiring process. Blacks just want to lecture Whites but I won’t have my intelligence insulted by their self-imposed limitations because of lack of intelligence and the race card (the king of spades).
Posted by White is Beautiful Robert at 8:56 PM on March 26
Lou Dobbs is the first person in the media who dared to say let’s openly talk about race…and let the chips fall where they may…the racist label is used to silence people…posters on this website of all people should know that by now!
Posted by Lisette at 9:18 PM on March 26
Following Obama’s speech a letter appeared in the main newspaper for Berkeley, CA that spoke in an open manner I’ve seen only once or twice before in Berkeley. Here’s one sentence from that letter:
“As long as “talking about race in America” means nothing but blacks airing their grievances and refusing to allow white people to speak honestly about our experiences, and our grievances, which include anti-white racism, or our concern about blacks such as Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson “playing the race card” in a manipulative and self-serving fashion, then the “dialogue” ensuing is little but a biased sermon, is untruthful and is no dialogue at all.”
I believe this extract shows that Obama has opened up an opportunity for us to be more heard, if we are willing and able to take advantage of it. Something in the way he spoke DID give permission to whites to speak up in a more open way in the public forum. (Yes, “permission”—that’s the sad fact of the matter).
(For anyone who is interested, the rest of the letter is under ” DISINGENUOUS”, at):
http://www.berkeleydailyplanet.com/issue/2008-03-25/article/29564
Posted by H. Dumpty at 6:12 AM on March 27
Some ethnic peoples only have the ability to talk “smack” with no apparent capability for reason.
Why bother?
Posted by jdavis at 9:37 AM on March 27
I’ll just keep saying it over and over again; why not?
The Family - the most basic bio-social unit since the Paleolithic, certainly Neolithic Age, is in ruins, and we’re talking about Race relations? As if being a failure in one will automatically make us a success in the other!
And we’re not just talking about Race, we’re obsessing over it. Like an Addict obsessing over an addiction, and for the same reason, ie; the addiction keeps him out of Reality. Our obsession over Race is a manifestation of our aversion toward Reality. Race is a pretext. I wasn’t impressed as a teenager and I’m not now as a man. It is one method more of avoiding reality. This is the reason why I post here, as I’ve said before. Because of the REALISM in Race Realism. I know from a lot of personal experience, whether immediate family, cousins, friends, neighbors, where they have so many family needs that are left unattended but the obsession with Race rages on!
Posted by Dedalus at 11:55 AM on March 27
This “discussion” was intended merely to be more of the usual whining by US blacks, but judging from that Berkely Daily Planet letter, the Obamanible Showman’s propaganda seems to have backfired on his handlers.
The hype is provoking exactly the sort of discussion Obama’s campaign can not afford.
Posted by Michael C. Scott at 1:23 PM on March 27
One thing Obama and his fancy little speech have proven… yes, he is black enough!
Posted by GetBackJack at 2:39 PM on March 27
The only discussion about race is one that I gave at Stirling:
“Lower your flag. March straight home, stopping at every village along the way and apologize for a hundred years of theft, rape and murder. Do it, and you shall live. Do it not…”
Posted by William Wallace at 4:56 PM on March 27
Stop and think about it…Jesse Jackson hasnt worked a day in his life, he has toured the world, sat in first class stadium seats,front row concert seats,been invited to dozens of resorts for “workshops”, had teaching posts, ridden in private jets all by rehashing the same racial “conversation” to the point of nausea. Its a multi million dollar industry for a group of people who couldnt hold down a middle management job
in the real world. Of course they want it to continue forever.
Posted by at 10:16 PM on March 28
regarding whiteplight:
“We ought to be careful about defining people. If a liberal writes an article that agrees with us, we ought to encourage it rather than attempt to confine them in a box that we define for them. How else do we expect to gain recruits? And we need recruits - just look at the handful of habitual posters on Amren and realize how small this community really is….”
—— there are probably only a “handful of habitual POSTERS” on ANY website… most people who visit a website just read the articles and never post comments. perhaps mr. taylor might care to place a “counter” that shows just how many hits he gets to amren.
Posted by at 4:39 AM on March 30
Black people need to stop complaining, get to work, and start cracking the books.
If you can’t cut the mustard, you aren’t going anywhere in life, and that’s true no matter what shade of skin you have.
Somebody needs to verbally toungue lash anyone who continues to promote victimology and downplay the importance of competency.
No more excuses.
Posted by Common Sense at 1:59 PM on March 30
I felt some vague memory that these same universities recruited black students and other racial minorities, on the grounds that interracial conversations on campus are as important as talking about math, science and literature.
My history course my freshman year in college had one black and 2 or 3 Muslims in it. I can assure you that their presence did not encourage healthy - and certainly not honest - discourse about Islam, race, or anything else. In fact they hardly said anything at all, while most of the whites were unwilling to offend anyone. I broached the subjects in my usual bold ways, but that was rare.
It seems the more “diverse” a society or school gets the less willing it is to broach topics honestly. After all, books can be read and guest speakers can be brought in to present alternate views, but guest speakers leave and books don’t get offended. Can’t say that for other students.
In the aftermath of Barack Obama’s call for a racial dialogue has any mainstream media writer once mentioned IQ?
Like I said…
Posted by Alan at 4:36 PM on March 30
If you feel the system has been hurting you, well it has but it has more to do with who we keep sending to represent us than the party they belong to.
I am trying to understand why few posts take note of the polite and under the radar corruption in this country examples such as lobbyist favors and special health insurance for congress extending to the quiet organized crime control of 75% of the construction industry.
We may not be able to take on organized crime without much bloodshed but we can do something about elected officials. If you have an income inadequate to provide basic support or no reliable access to health care, then you are part of the millions of Americans of many races who should be the number one domestic policy of our elected representatives.
Instead, a very large block of Senators considers extending for another year an originally temporary tax break on high incomes and would not override a Presidential veto to give all US children access to health care.
I am a white male fortunate to have a middle class income and the free time to do many community things that are not as a means of helping my family. I am probably somewhat socially conservative and expect all who are able to work and to give a goal oriented life a chance. But life can be hard and many feel there is no one who cares about them and here we have a congress favoring the wealthy and spurning children.
Believe me after never having voted for a victorious president beginning with my first election in 1972, I grow more convinced all the time how much we need to change the good ol boy way of making decisions that affect you and your family. Very sad to use good ol boy in a nasty way and I apologize.
What can we do? First, think about who is going to take the risk to cause a peaceful revolution in this country that puts people ahead of corporations and political favors. On a personal basis we can spend more of our at home time and youth activity time bonding with our kids about how to make their local community a better place. Then as they grow older they will spend the time to demand accountability of those who are going to represent them in Washington.
Thank you for thinking about these comments.
Posted by at 10:13 PM on March 31
“It seems the more “diverse” a society or school gets the less willing it is to broach topics honestly.” (Posted by Alan at 4:36 PM on March 30)
Yes, and even if I’m talking alone with my white next-door neighbor who agrees with my views to a great extent, he still gets uncomfortable if I mention anything racial.
I forget the name of the study that showed that as diversity increases, trust decreases even between members of the same racial group.
Posted by H. Dumpty at 5:24 AM on April 2
