Donahue Show:
Angry White Men (Part II)

Feb. 10, 2003

GUESTS: Jared Taylor

HIGHLIGHT: Jared Taylor believes America should be a white country, and that immigration of people of color is threatening to destroy white society.

BODY: ANNOUNCER: Tonight, one-on-one with white separatist publisher Jared Taylor.

He says racial diversity is ruining white culture. And the American melting pot needs a lid. From closing our borders to low IQs in black and Hispanics, Jared Taylor brings controversial his ideas and a fiery debate to DONAHUE with a live audience and your phone calls. DONAHUE starts right now.

PHIL DONAHUE, HOST: Good evening and welcome to DONAHUE. We’re live from New York City. Tonight joined by Jared Taylor, editor of “American Renaissance.” He says he’s white separatist. He says he believes whites need to realize that the United States is their nation, it belongs to whites and nobody else.

White separatists claim he’s the Paul Revere of today, warning white America that they will lose their identity. Others say he is spreading an agenda of hate. Let’s look at the last time he was on. I asked him about why he feels threatened by immigration. He said this. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JARED TAYLOR, “AMERICAN RENAISSANCE”: The Mexican officials themselves are proud of the fact that, as they say, street by street, town by town, Mexico is taking back the Southwestern part of the United States.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DONAHUE: Jared, you think immigrants are taking over this country. Explain yourself.

TAYLOR: Well, listen to Charles Truheil (ph). He’s a visiting professor of Chicano studies at the University of New Mexico. He says, that the creation of Hispanic nation in the Southwestern part of the United States in the next 80 years is an inevitability in his words. He says, I’m quoting him, “We will one day be a majority and reclaim our birth right.” That means you and I get kicked out.

DONAHUE: Well, no, no. First of all, the only thing separating us is an imaginary line.

TAYLOR: Imaginary? That’s what borders are for. Borders are real.

DONAHUE: But he’s also, I think, dealing with the reality of the fact that the majority of the people on this face of the globe are people of color.

TAYLOR: All the more reason for whites to have an area where they are a majority, for heaven’s sake.

Look, Koreans are a minority on the face of the globe. Does that mean they have to be a minority in Korea?

DONAHUE: And you believe the whole issue of terrorism, we’re now on high alert, those are related. Don’t you? You think immigration and terrorists alert . . .

TAYLOR: Well that fact that—you see, until 1965, we had an immigration policy that was designed to keep the country majority white. It was quite specific in that respect.

Since that time, we’ve let in millions of people from all around the world, which means that if terrorists happen to be Muslim, if they happen to be Arab, Middle Eastern, there are huge communities in which they can disappear.

We would never have had that problem before 1965. Any person, any young Muslim with a beard, shifty eyed, didn’t speak English, stick out like a sore thumb.

DONAHUE: Shifty eyed?

TAYLOR: Well, look at those pictures of Mohammed Atta. He look like a cool cucumber to you?

DONAHUE: Well, you know, I’ve seen some Irish people in a bar that looked kind of shifty eyed. I don’t think that’s exclusive to one particular identity.

Who would you let in, Mr. Taylor?

TAYLOR: At this point, there are 280 million Americans. When’s the last time you were driving down the road and you said to yourself, Gosh, there are not enough cars on the highway? When’s the last time you were standing line, We’ve got too many people already. We don’t need anymore people.

DONAHUE: People of color cause that problem?

TAYLOR: No. Just all sorts of people swarming in from all over the place.
But you see, we import nearly a million people every year. Ninety percent of whom are nonwhite.

DONAHUE: You know, this was an white nation.

TAYLOR: What do you mean not a white nation?

DONAHUE: It certainly didn’t originate as a white part of the world. You know exactly what I mean. I don’t know why you would want to tap dance around that.

TAYLOR: The very first naturalization law in the United States, written in 1790, the country was not even 20 years old. It reserved naturalization to free white people. It was quite specific and explicit about that.

In fact, practically every prominent American, up until about the 1950s, had racial views almost indistinguishable from mine. Practically without exception.

DONAHUE: You are the gentile racist, as some have suggested. Here you are in your shirt and tie. Yale . . .

TAYLOR: You, too. Short and tie.

DONAHUE: Yes, well, I’m trying work my way up here. It’s not easy. But, Let me just tell you, you’re a Yale graduate, 1973. Is that right?

TAYLOR: You’ve done your work.

DONAHUE: And I assume you’re not invited back to Yale to speak, are you?

TAYLOR: I’ve tried to get invited. They won’t have me. I’ve been to many other different universities. You’d think my alma matter would have me, but not yet.

DONAHUE: Where’s this fear come from, Jared? What are you afraid of? We are all God’s children. You cannot vulcanize the world and say you’re this color and you can’t come in. You’re this color and you can’t come in.

Incidentally, your argument of keeping out the Arabs, as you refer broadly to people of Middle Eastern origin, is that we wouldn’t be able to find them because we have too many Arabs now. In other words, they blend in.

TAYLOR: Exactly.

DONAHUE: You know, that’s almost funny if it weren’t so ridiculous.

TAYLOR: It’s so obvious . . .

DONAHUE: In other words, if we had an all white nation, boy, we could grab those people of color right away. Couldn’t we? My grandmother, hit them over the head with her umbrella.

TAYLOR: Look, how easy would it be for Mohammed Atta and his 19 pals . . .

DONAHUE: If we wouldn’t have let all those other people in . . .

TAYLOR: Let me finish. In Japan, how easily could they have blended in? Very hard. How well would they have blended in Korea? How about Iceland? They would have had a very tough time.

This business about vulcanization, the world vulcanizes itself. We don’t have to make that happen. The folly is in inviting people utterly unlike the native population into a nation and then trying to get them to live in peace. That’s complete craziness. It has never worked.

DONAHUE: The native population in this country . . .

TAYLOR: We are now native population.

DONAHUE: You know, imagine if they adopted your—you’d have never arrived.
If Native Americans had the power that you want to exercise in keeping people out, this would be a monoracial nation. It would be a red nation.

TAYLOR: And if diversity was such a wonderful thing, why isn’t it Christmas year round for the Indians? I mean, tell me. If diversity is a great thing, the Indians should be happy as clams.

DONAHUE: The—first of all, the Indians had enough trouble with the so-called Christians coming over here and in the name God, being massacred.

So let’s have a little reflection on the part of the Christian community who claimed to come here with the noble purpose of domesticating the savages.

We’ve used all kind of excuses to get away from people who are different.

And we have failed to celebrate the fabulous nature of, for example, New York City. Were you scared coming in from the airport? You see all those brown people?

TAYLOR: If I’d taken a wrong turn, Mr.—if I’d taken a wrong turn and headed north, I would have gone through parts of New York City that look like Afghanistan. The look like Afghanistan . . .

DONAHUE: That is not about pigmentation. That is about maldistribution of wealth. It’s not about being able to afford a school system that might give your kid a chance. It’s about going against red lining and banks.

Residential areas are segregated by institutions. And we’re all fighting them and you should be too.

TAYLOR: Why isn’t that black populations in every multiracial society end up exactly as they do in the United States? They end up looking like Afghanistan wherever you find them, be it in Canada, be it the U.K.

DONAHUE: I’d like to see the kind of house and neighborhood you live in if you couldn’t go to Yale, if you hadn’t had the opportunity of going to of what probably a very well-funded public school system when you were small.

I’m here to say that I think the majority of Americans feel that they are blessed by the diversity of this country. They enjoy music of many cultures.
What, incidentally, what kind of—your name is Taylor.

TAYLOR: Correct.

DONAHUE: That is what?

TAYLOR: It’s an English name.

DONAHUE: English.

TAYLOR: That shouldn’t be difficult. I’ll tell you about my neighborhood.
All my neighbors are rich, white and good looking. I like it that way and they like it that way, too.

DONAHUE: You told our producer that. My neighborhood is all rich. Somebody in the audience said what were you doing there?

This will happen. “My neighborhood is all rich,” you said. “White and good looking, and I love it. I was at a cocktail party last night. And believe me, no one was thinking that we need some cannibals, poor black people or lesbians to make it a better party.”

That’s a cruel, cruel kind of smart ass comment from a guy from Yale.

TAYLOR: Is it true or is it false?

DONAHUE: Cannibals? Poor black people? And lesbians? You’re going to stand by that statement?

TAYLOR: You’re telling me, Americans feel blessed by diversity?

DONAHUE: Yes they do.

TAYLOR: Why is it that they escape from it at every opportunity? Why is it that every church service, practically in this country, is segregated? Why is it that when people are free to invite their own selection of guests to their dinner party or backyard barbecue, it’s almost always homogeneous and diverse? It’s because diversity is not a source of strength. It’s a source of hostility. People don’t want it in their own lives if they can help it.

DONAHUE: I think you’re overlooking a lot of the wonderful, wonderful cultures that exist without a monoracial feature to the whole neighborhood.

But you do make a point. Do you make a point, Mr. Taylor, all of us to have look in the mirror and say, What have I done to contribute to the separation? But you’re drawing an awfully broad stroke.

But you’re drawing an awfully broad strokes here. There are all kinds of examples of the benefits of an interracial society.

TAYLOR: Name one.

DONAHUE: Food. Culture. Music. All contributions of people and Nobel laureates, who have been from Hispanic neighborhoods.

All kinds of scientific discoveries by people of Asian, African-American and, as you would say, central European culture.

TAYLOR: How many Hispanic Nobel laureates are there? Name one for me.

DONAHUE: There are, as a matter of fact, there are more Hispanic Nobel laureates than any other single ethnic group.

TAYLOR: Name one. In the United States?

DONAHUE: Do you want to challenge me on that? Do you want to challenge me on that?

TAYLOR: In the United States?

DONAHUE: Than any other single ethnic group.

TAYLOR: Let’s get the statistics, bud.

You know, the last time, the last time you told an incredible whopper. You said that there were more Hispanic Medal of Honor winners than any other ethnic group. I looked into this, just out of curiosity.

In the second world war, there were 12 Hispanic Medal of Honor winners. There were no fewer than 50 with Irish names, my friend. Irish names. That’s not even counting German Americans, English Americans. You were completely wrong on that. You’re completely wrong on this now.

DONAHUE: Josh from Tennessee. I’m glad you waited. Are you there?

CALLER: Yes, I’m here.

DONAHUE: Go ahead.

CALLER: Mr. Taylor, you need give it up. You’re not near as entertaining as Archy Bunker was.

TAYLOR: I don’t mean to entertain. I mean to instruct and enlighten.

DONAHUE: You really believe that you can stop a citizen, an individual child of God? You can stop solely, tell him where he has to live, and in what country he has to reside totally on the basis of the color of his skin? You believe that?

TAYLOR: I think—I believe in freedom of association. We should be able to establish our neighborhoods. We should be able to establish our country in a way that we see fit. And the fact that whites prefer the societies built by whites with the culture of whites, it’s perfectly normal, natural and healthy, and that right should not be denied.

DONAHUE: Jason in Michigan writes, “take a look at the shuttle Columbia crew last week. What a picture of America. A great blend of what it takes to make the world a better place.” Should black folks get on that shuttle? Be able to ride the shuttle? Tell me your feelings about that.

TAYLOR: I’m not talking about individuals. You can have all sorts of individual exceptions. I’m talk about group dynamics.

DONAHUE: Oh, I see, exception.

TAYLOR: Yes. When you have group dynamics, you invariably have group and ethnic tensions. You can have individuals who get along fine. But when you get groups together, there’s invariably friction. And that cannot be avoided.

DONAHUE: This is Jared Taylor, editor of “American Renaissance,” claims not to be a white supremacist, but a white separatist. We’ll be back here in just a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DONAHUE: We’re back with Jared Taylor, who believes that whites need to oppose immigration. Yes, the young woman wanted to say?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Mr. Taylor, how would you view the ideal American society? Similar to the Third Reich in Germany?

TAYLOR: My views of American society have nothing whatsoever to do with European history. My intellectual antecedents are specifically American.

Thomas Jefferson, Woodrow Wilson, Teddy Roosevelt.

All of those people took for granted that this was a European society. The idea that diversity was some sort of strength was completely alien to their idea. And as I say, until 1965, we had an immigration policy designed to keep the country majority white. It has nothing to do with European history at all.

DONAHUE: Here’s what you said, just one of many thing you said. And you’ll stand by this, I’m said. “Ugly Mexicans and ugly Haitians come here to live permanently. But we are supposed to be endlessly sensitive to their peculiarities and revel in the diversity of toadying to their ethnic demands.” Jared Taylor, “American Renaissance,” June 1996. You know, and Ben Franklin was concerned about the Germans coming into Pennsylvania. He said we’d all be Germanized. Holy cow, the Germans are coming.

You know, you’re not the first person to throw up these red flags, to be frightened of other people. You follow a long line of folk, and you do mention some rather famous people in our past who . . .

TAYLOR: Abraham Lincoln, likewise. Yes, he did free the slaves, but he wanted to export every black from the United States. He wanted a completely white society. He said that—he said that slavery was a terrible injustice, but the idea of a multiracial society was unnatural . . .

DONAHUE: Ugly Mexicans and ugly Haitians, you said that?

TAYLOR: I don’t remember writing that. That’s very unlike the way I write.
I’d be surprised . . .

DONAHUE: Come here to live permanently?

(CROSSTALK)

DONAHUE: You do remember, though, going to your own neighborhood party where all the people are good looking. You have no homely people in your neighborhood. You remember that.

TAYLOR: That was largely a joke. We’re not all—the neighborhood is not exclusively good looking, obviously.

DONAHUE: Lisa from Florida. Mr. Taylor is on the line. You wanted to say.

CALLER: Yes, living in South Florida, our school systems are horrifically overcrowded. They’re overcrowded because of illegal people from South America and Haiti. They come here on a daily basis. We have 40 and 50 legal American children in a classroom that cannot be properly educated, and we do not need people who will not learn the language. They speak to each other in their own language. They don’t want to fit in. And our children sit and are held back while we try to teach these children.

DONAHUE: I don’t know whether it’s fair to blame the immigrants for whatever may be the situation in your school system. Do you acknowledge that—you’re gone. (UNINTELLIGIBLE) was a Cuban and was chairman of the board of Coca-Cola. We have all kinds of contributions. I could go on and on.

TAYLOR: The point is not to blame the immigrants. It’s to blame the people who run this country for permitting this to happen. You know, I am always amazed at the generosity of liberals. Let me make a point here, Mr. Donahue.

DONAHUE: I’m listening.

TAYLOR: Liberals are convince that had it is would not fully enriching to go to school that poor Mexicans or Haitian who can’t speak English or ghetto blacks who beat you up and shake you up for lunch money. That’s wonderfully diverse that’s wonderfully enriching. They nobly forego that for their children. No, no. They reserve this wonderful diversity for the children of white people who live in trailer parks.

DONAHUE: Yes. A white kid can’t beat you up and take your lunch money? Why would you lay all this illicit behavior on one color of people? There is enough sin to go around. And we’re all capable of committing it.

Why focus in like there such an angry, hostile, frightened way?

TAYLOR: Because it’s real, Mr. Donahue. This is real.

DONAHUE: The gentleman wanted to ask.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, I have a question for you, Mr. Taylor. I don’t know if your group focuses on anything positive as far as diversity or immigration.

Is there anything positive that your group is involved in or that you see?

TAYLOR: If you look all around the world today, the headline where people are killing each other most diligently generally are places where you find diversity. Where people in Ireland, there is religious diversity. They’re killing each other. In the Middle East, there’s ethnic diversity. They’re killing each other. In is Sudan, north and south there’s racial diversity.
They are killing each other. Diversity is dangerous, attention ridden thing wherever you fine it. I see no good in it anywhere.

DONAHUE: And you wanted to then apparently create nations that are mono-racial. You would balkanize the whole world.

TALYOR: The world started out more or less that way. It’s only because of immigration that it ceased to be.

DONAHUE: And we’ve got the lousy thing called the airplane. We aviation and travel. And the ability . . .

TAYLOR: Look, there are certain countries, Japan, for example. Many Filipinos, many South Asians would love to live in Japan because it’s a wealth successful country. The Japanese have this quaint idea that they would like to stay Japanese. They don’t let them in. I say god bless them.
They have every right to that. They’re preserving a society that suits them and was created by their ancestors.

DONAHUE: How are you with the Jews? Are you OK, the Jews?

TAYLOR: The Jews? The Jews are fine by me.

DONAHUE: And so Jews can live in your neighborhood and to go your cocktail party with all those good looking people?

TAYLOR: They look white to me.

How are you with the jews?

DONAHUE: Did you not—you take money from Pioneer—from the Pioneer Fund, do you not?

TAYLOR: We have received . . .

DONAHUE: The Pioneer Fund is famous for denying the Holocaust. You don’t do that, do you?

TALYOR: No.

DONAHUE: Do you believe Holocaust existed?

TALYOR: Look, as I said, my racial views have nothing to with European history. They are strictly about America.

DONAHUE: Do you believe the Holocaust existed?

TAYLOR: Of course. Obviously, Hitler was trying to do away with the Jews of Europe.

DONAHUE: And yet you continue to take money from the Pioneers.

TAYLOR: The Pioneer Fund has nothing whatsoevered to with the Holocaust.
Nothing. You’ve missed your research on that.

DONAHUE: The first president of the Pioneer Fund was one of my people. A fellow by the name of (UNINTELLIGIBLE). And he denied the Holocaust.

That’s—that’s the reason he existed. He spent his whole life preaching that the Holocaust never existed. And you’re taking money from the outfit that he headed. Now, you’re awfully close here.

TAYLOR: This is pure silliness. The New Century Foundation, which I’m president, has accepted one or two grants. We haven’t gotten any money for several year. The Pioneer Fund has absolutely nothing whatsoevered to with the Holocaust denial. Harry Lathlyn (ph) started that before the second World War. Before anybody had ever heard of the Holocaust. You’re completely wrong on that. Just like your Hispanic nobel prize winner.

DONAHUE: Susan from Pennsylvania you wanted to day—hello.

CALLER: Yes, Susan from (UNINTELLIGIBLE) Pennsylvania. Mr. Taylor, you forget the people who are now protecting the United States are people from different ethnic nationalities. You might be in the wrong country.

DONAHUE: That’s the truth. We have a very multiracial, multiethnic armed forces. And they’re out there risking their you know what’s for you and your freedom to speak.

TAYLOR: And you know, Charles Wrangle wants to institute the draft because he thinks there are too many blacks in our volunteer army.

How is that for patriotism?

DONAHUE: Too many blacks fought in the Vietnam War. There’s nothing unpatriotic about that. If your father could afford a lawyer, you didn’t have to go. And we have poor white kids and people of color fight that war.

TAYLOR: Blacks are accounted for 12 percent of the casualties in vietnam.
Precisely their proportion of the population. They did not shoulder a disproportion at burden.

DONAHUE: I’ll give you a chance. You don’t have to turn that on. We have it all ready to go for you. You’ll be first when we come back, Jared Taylor, in just a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DONAHUE: “American Renaissance,” June—you said you never said “ugly Mexicans and ugly Haitians come here to live permanently.”

TAYLOR: Maybe I did.

DONAHUE: Here’s the article, “American Renaissance.”

TAYLOR: OK.

DONAHUE: “If we do nothing, the nation we are building is one in which we would not wish to live,” Jared Taylor—“ugly Mexicans,” “ugly Haitians.” You said that sounds like something you wouldn’t say. You did say it. You wrote it, and you published it.

By the way, in chemistry, Professor Maria Molina (ph) is a Mexican, in physics, Louis Alvarez (ph), Spanish-American, 1968, Dr. Severa Ochoa (ph), a Spanish-American in Medicine, 1958, literature—shall I go on? Octavio Paz, Jose Sela (ph), Gabriel Marquez, Vincente Alexandre (ph), Pablo Neruda, Juan Ramon Jimenez (ph) . . .

TAYLOR: These are not Americans.

DONAHUE: . . . Gabrielle Mistral (ph)—you said—you did say I couldn’t name one, and I . . .

TAYLOR: These are not Americans. They’re from Latin America.

DONAHUE: Oh, I see.

TAYLOR: They’re Latin American. They’re not United States citizens.

DONAHUE: And so therefore, that put . . .

TAYLOR: Well . . .

DONAHUE: Why wouldn’t you want them at your cocktail party where all these wonderful, good-looking people are . . .

(LAUGHTER)

TAYLOR: Look, I bet you . . .

DONAHUE: . . . regardless of whether they’re . . .

TAYLOR: I bet you . . .

DONAHUE: . . . or not they’re Americans?

TAYLOR: I bet you that you . . .

DONAHUE: I wish they were! I wonder if they’re—if their people, if their families would have been allowed in, in your—if you were in charge of immigration.

TAYLOR: I would bet you, believe it or not, that the huge majority of them are also white, my friend, probably pure Castilian Spanish.

DONAHUE: The gentleman had a question. Sir?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. Taylor, good evening.

TAYLOR: Good evening.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: As an American, I respect your right to have your beliefs, but there’s one thing that’s just totally baffling to me.

DONAHUE: What is that?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Didn’t white people get here because of immigration?
There was a little place down the road here called Ellis Island that let in Italians, Germans, Irish.

DONAHUE: “Bring me your tired” . . .

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You wouldn’t be sitting . . .

DONAHUE: . . . “your poor” . . .

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: . . . in that chair today if it wasn’t for immigration. And I notice . . .

(APPLAUSE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And furthermore, I notice that in your conversation with—about immigration, that the only problem that you have with immigration is with people of color. I don’t hear you say that we shouldn’t let any more Italians in, we shouldn’t let any more Germans in.

TAYLOR: First of all, my ancestors were not immigrants. They were pioneers.

(LAUGHTER)

TAYLOR: They built the country—they built the country that the Ellis Islanders came to. There was no country when my ancestors showed up here.
First of all, also, every country starts off as a nation of immigrants.
Eventually, it decides that they like it the way it is, and they decide to become a nation of natives.

The same is true of every European country, every Asian country. Every nation has the right to close its doors, just as you have the right to close and lock the door to your house. Letting anybody in is like leaving the door unlocked. Anybody can come to lunch uninvited at your house. That is what we are doing in the United States of America.

Furthermore, you just heard me say I don’t think the United States needs any more people.

DONAHUE: Right.

TAYLOR: We don’t need any more consumption of resources. We don’t need any more strip malls.

DONAHUE: Who would you let in, Mr. Taylor?

TAYLOR: I’ll tell you . . .

DONAHUE: The audience would like to know.

TAYLOR: I’ll tell you who I would let in.

DONAHUE: Who would you let in?

TAYLOR: There’s going to be a big debate within the next few years about South Africans and white Zimbabweans who are being killed and run off their land because they are a small and dwindling white minority in Africa.

And the question will come up, Should we let them in? Yes, I think we should. I think they are a terribly persecuted minority. The cry will go up, Oh, no, those wicked racists, can’t let them. Let them stay there and be shot and dispossessed.

DONAHUE: You wouldn’t have let Colin Powell’s ancestors in, would you.

TAYLOR: I think . . .

DONAHUE: You would not have let Condoleezza Rice’s ancestors in.

TAYLOR: As I have told you, I think a multi-racial society is invariably one of friction and complexity.

DONAHUE: So we should build a fence, and we should all stare at each other and be suspicious.

TAYLOR: No! What . . .

DONAHUE: You know, really, this is a very—I mean this as no personal insult. I don’t want to get down there. But it—you know, this is—for a man of your education . . .

TAYLOR: That’s why I believe these things!

DONAHUE: . . . this is ignorant!

(CROSSTALK)

(APPLAUSE)

DONAHUE: You can’t possibly, possibly make this—oh! You—there aren’t enough troops to make this happen!

TAYLOR: Look . . .

DONAHUE: You don’t have enough uniforms and a large enough constabulary to make this happen.

TAYLOR: Mr. Donahue, that is pure silliness. We have got enough troops to go thousands of miles, halfway around the world . . .

DONAHUE: Well . . .

TAYLOR: . . . and change a regime way on the other side of the world. We don’t have enough troops to guard the Mexican border? That’s nonsense!

DONAHUE: Sam . . .

TAYLOR: We could do it in a heartbeat, if we felt like it.

DONAHUE: Sam—and just shoot them if they get through.

TAYLOR: You wouldn’t have to shoot many, would you.

DONAHUE: Sam from North Carolina.

TAYLOR: They would soon learn.

DONAHUE: Hi, Sam.

CALLER: Hi. Mr. Taylor . . .

TAYLOR: Yes?

CALLER: . . . you are trying to ignore and neglect the native American history. You are trying to stop the immigration, the way to the future of this country. That’s not going to happen. Life goes on. Go home and read history.

(APPLAUSE)

DONAHUE: Yes. And relax. And don’t be so frightened.

TAYLOR: It’s—let me answer. It’s precisely because do I read history that I am opposed to this dispossession of the majority people. Any people that lets itself be displaced and dispossessed by aliens will eventually be shoved aside by others who have sharper elbows and a firmer sense of their own peoplehood.

DONAHUE: May I ask you to—yes, ma’am. You wanted to say? Please.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi. I’m from Argentina.

Mr. Taylor, I would like to ask you, what if we had no immigration, so I wouldn’t be able to be here, we have no black people out there, so I wouldn’t have been able to meet all the wonderful people I have met ever in my life, to have—to see different cultures, to see how different people act and talk and think, so I would never be able to learn from others, just from the ones that are near me and just be the same all the time?

TAYLOR: Yes. I think . . .

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So that’s—I feel it’s a question of education, rather than being all different. What if you were born tomorrow to be a black person or somewhere—from—I don’t know . . .

TAYLOR: I think that . . .

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: . . . yellowish, or whatever.

TAYLOR: . . . if you had moved to Brazil, you would have had all the thing you’ve described and even more. I don’t want the United States to turn into a Brazil, with this minority white class surrounded by large numbers of brown and black people who live in a kind of desperation, while the whites who run the country live behind gated communities in terror. They have armed bodyguards. That is direction the United States is heading, and I don’t want to go that way.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I’ve been here for just a month, and I must tell you, I’m really delighted. I’ve been walking all about, going in the underground, and nothing has happened to me.

DONAHUE: Here in the city. You went on the subway?

TAYLOR: Well, now . . .

DONAHUE: See? And you’re missing it!

TAYLOR: Now—now, isn’t . . .

DONAHUE: I mean . . .

TAYLOR: Now, isn’t that a testimony to the greatness of the United States?
She’s been here for a whole month and not yet been mugged!

DONAHUE: All right! Oh, well . . .

TAYLOR: Amazing!

DONAHUE: Did you keep your head down in the back of the cab as you came in from the airport? Did you say . . .

TAYLOR: As I say, we didn’t take any wrong turns.

DONAHUE: Did you say giving the women the vote may have been one of the biggest mistakes we’ve ever made? Did you say that? It says here that you did.

TAYLOR: Oh, I—I—you know, apparently, you can’t joke about anything anymore, can you.

DONAHUE: Oh, that’s a joke. OK. Michael Levin (ph)—you know Michael Levin.

TAYLOR: Oh, yes.

DONAHUE: And you admire him.

TAYLOR: Oh, yes. I do.

DONAHUE: Here—he suggested that blacks have a shorter time horizon. He said that we should be permitted to stop young black males driving expensive cars, since there was probable cause to believe they were felons. Do you agree with that?

TAYLOR: As far as the time horizon, this experiment’s been done many times.
If you take black children and white children and offer them one lollipop today, as opposed to three lollipops three days from now, more black children want the one lollipop today, rather than the three three days from now. That’s a well established fact. That’s what he’s talking about, the time horizon, the desire to have instant gratification now, rather than sacrifice for satisfaction later on.

DONAHUE: You believe that.

TAYLOR: I mean, that’s what the data shows. I mean, do you disbelieve it?
Are the scientists lying?

DONAHUE: Peter in Massachusetts writes, “If you had a complete white society, there would still be the rich and the poor. There would still be the smart and the dumb. There would still be the good-looking and the ugly.
People will always find a reason to hate. It doesn’t just have to be race.”

(APPLAUSE)

DONAHUE: We are in New York City with Jared Taylor.

I don’t know—are you drawing crowds? I mean, how big is this community that follows you? We really are curious about this. We’ll always live with frightened people like you. I’m wondering how much force they have.

TAYLOR: Look—“frightened”—look, do the Tibetans have any justification in being frightened that all these Han Chinese moving into Tibet are going to destroy their culture and heritage? Are they justified in being frightened?

DONAHUE: There are . . .

TAYLOR: Answer me!

DONAHUE: . . . conflicts where you don’t want the people who hate you coming into your neighborhood. Most of the people who come to this country come here because they admire the society.

TAYLOR: And Hispanic . . .

DONAHUE: It’s not about hate at all. And we have benefited so much from the arrival of these immigrants, including my own . . .

TAYLOR: I bet the Han Chinese . . .

DONAHUE: . . . family.

TAYLOR: . . . who are pouring into Tibet say, We just love Tibet. We love those monasteries. We just want the Tibetans to speak Chinese, not Tibetan anymore. Of course, they’re justified. As whites become a dwindling minority, the society will change in ways that they don’t care for. They all feel that way, and that’s why they flee to the suburbs when their neighborhoods changed. They just have been browbeaten into pretending that that’s not the case.

DONAHUE: And we’ll be . . .

TAYLOR: They won’t admit it.

DONAHUE: We’ll be back with Jared Taylor in just a moment.

ANNOUNCER: She’s due to give birth today and has been missing for more than a month. Tomorrow Donahue sits down with Laci Peterson’s family. Find out where their search is leading them and their thoughts on the recent conduct of Laci’s husband. DONAHUE from Modesto tomorrow.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DONAHUE: We’re back with Jared Taylor.

Mike, are you there, from Illinois? Mike?

CALLER: I am.

DONAHUE: Hi. Go ahead.

CALLER: Your guest talks about history and science a lot, but he’s neglected to recognize every clash of cultures in human history that’s ever occurred has resulted in a stronger and more advanced society. Every culture that’s tried to isolate itself has either deteriorated, you know, itself out of existence or turned—made itself irrelevant.

DONAHUE: Yes.

CALLER: And then doctors and scientists generally consider heterogeneous people, meaning of an ethnically mixed background, to be genetically healthier than homogeneous people.

DONAHUE: Yes.

CALLER: So how do you respond to that?

DONAHUE: Yes. Diversity . . .

TAYLOR: First of all . . .

DONAHUE: . . . promotes . . .

TAYLOR: First of all . . .

DONAHUE: . . . well-being.

TAYLOR: . . . it is unprecedented in the history of the world that a majority people willingly give up its majority. That has never, ever happen. It often happens that some very vigorous band of outsiders will come in and conquer them, but never has a great majority people said, You want this corner of our territory? Take it. You want this piece? Take it. That is historically unprecedented. Never has a people given up its birthright that way! That’s some kind of sickness in whites.

DONAHUE: Well, just—just for the—we should make this point, and I think it ought to be obvious. No other nation on Earth has so nobly dealt with the suspicions, the angers, the prejudices, the language difficulties, as has the most diverse nation, civilization in the history of the world. I speak of the United States America.

TAYLOR: No . . .

DONAHUE: You take 10 cabs in New York, you’re driven by a person from 10 different countries.

TAYLOR: Yes, a lot of them don’t (UNINTELLIGIBLE)

DONAHUE: And it is—and we have our problems, to be sure. And it is challenging. But the results are wonderful! They’re good for our kids.
They’re good for our country, as this young man made the point from Illinois. And here you are, standing in the last bastion of racism, bigotry and hatred . . .

TAYLOR: Racism? Oh, come on!

DONAHUE: . . . and trying to fight the rising tide of diversity. You can’t do it. You’re doomed to lose. You can never, ever stop . . .

TAYLOR: Mr. Donahue . . .

DONAHUE: . . . the free movement of people in, especially all those who want to come to this country.

(APPLAUSE)

DONAHUE: We should be proud of this!

TAYLOR: Wait, wait, wait!

DONAHUE: We should be celebrating it.

TAYLOR: Look, you can stop people moving very easily. Switzerland wouldn’t let you immigrate. Denmark would not let you immigrate. The Japanese wouldn’t let you. And Mexico would not let you immigrate.

DONAHUE: And all of those . . .

TAYLOR: Do you realize that?

DONAHUE: All of those . . .

TAYLOR: They can easily stop you. Furthermore—furthermore, you say we have this wonderful, wonderful diverse mix. Do you know how many federal lawsuits in this country are filed every year on racial discrimination?
Guess how many.

DONAHUE: It’s probably a lot.

TAYLOR: Guess how many.

DONAHUE: Tell me. Enlighten us.

TAYLOR: Twenty thousand! Is that a racial success?

DONAHUE: I’m saying that is the sign . . .

TAYLOR: Twenty thousand!

DONAHUE: . . . of a nation trying to get past the initial problems . . .

TAYLOR: Cuckoo!

DONAHUE: . . . that result because . . .

TAYLOR: Mr. Donahue, cuckoo!

DONAHUE: . . . of the fear we have . . .

TAYLOR: Twenty thousand . . .

DONAHUE: . . . of people who are different.

TAYLOR: . . . lawsuits!

DONAHUE: Cuckoo?

TAYLOR: That is cuckoo!

DONAHUE: You think it’s cuckoo. Well, I didn’t challenge your—I didn’t challenge your sanity. But . . .

Yes, sir? You . . .

TAYLOR: Well, I’m challenging yours!

DONAHUE: Yes? You wanted to say?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, first of all, it’s not at all inevitable that the whites will become a minority in their own country. And I would like to ask Jared Taylor if he thinks that as more and more whites realize that they’re becoming more outnumbered, whether there will be a rise in white activism.

DONAHUE: Yes.

TAYLOR: I think-

DONAHUE: Being outnumbered.

TAYLOR: Look, I have been making—I . . .

(CROSSTALK)

DONAHUE: Oh, those brown people are coming, and they’re going to get your mama! What are you afraid of?

(LAUGHTER)

DONAHUE: I mean, “outnumbered”? I mean, what is this, a game of sort of choose up sides? Go ahead, Jared.

TAYLOR: Every group in America . . .

DONAHUE: Tell them what . . .

TAYLOR: Every group in America stands for its own. It’s about time that we did, too.

DONAHUE: “Own.” Stands for its own.

TAYLOR: Mr. Donahue . . .

DONAHUE: God loves you better than those other people?

TAYLOR: No, no. God loves everybody equally. God wants, I think, every group to have its own society and culture as it sees fit. White people are only asking to be left alone, to let their own society evolve . . .

DONAHUE: OK.

TAYLOR: . . . as they see fit. And in answer to your question, I have been talking about these things . . .

DONAHUE: Briefly.

TAYLOR: . . . publicly for 10 years. Over those 10 years, the number of people who openly agree with me has increased exponentially.

DONAHUE: And we’ll be back in just a moment.

ANNOUNCER: He says the cause of crime and poverty in black and Hispanic communities has a direct relation to a lower IQ. When DONAHUE returns, Jared Taylor on race and intelligence quotients.

We’ll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DONAHUE: We’re back with Jared Taylor. From—Preston in California writes an e-mail. “I’m a tall, white, educated, good-looking, blue-eyed male from a good family who agrees with much of what you propound.”

TAYLOR: He’s not alone.

DONAHUE: “I’m also unabashedly gay, as well.”

(LAUGHTER)

TAYLOR: He’s not alone in that, either.

DONAHUE: “Would you let me come to one of your neighborhood parties?”

TAYLOR: There are many . . .

DONAHUE: Would you?

TAYLOR: . . . subscribers to “American Renaissance” who are homosexuals.

DONAHUE: So you’re—but you’re a homophobe. You don’t want the lesbian and gay . . .

TAYLOR: No, no.

DONAHUE: You said so.

TAYLOR: Look . . .

DONAHUE: What do you mean, “No”? You just said so.

TAYLOR: As far as the crisis that whites face today, it’s a racial crisis.
If anyone is with us, in terms of white racial consciousness, that is the fundamental question.

DONAHUE: Right.

TAYLOR: I have no animus against homosexuals.

DONAHUE: All right. Why did you put in lesbian, then, in that smart comment you made earlier?

TAYLOR: Because it was . . .

(CROSSTALK)

DONAHUE: Tell me about Philip Rushton (ph). You admire Philip Rushton.

TAYLOR: He’s a very serious scientist. Yes, he is.

DONAHUE: Yes.

TAYLOR: Now, are you going to . . .

DONAHUE: He says . . .

TAYLOR: . . . pull out some context (UNINTELLIGIBLE)

DONAHUE: He says that blacks, while possessing smaller brains, reproduce at a faster rate due to the larger size of their sex organ. Do you agree with that?

(LAUGHTER)

DONAHUE: It’s a tradeoff. More brain or more penis?

TAYLOR: That’s the quotation from him that you people love.

DONAHUE: You just said you admired him.

TAYLOR: If you go to our Web page at amren.com, you can order his book.

DONAHUE: Right.

TAYLOR: It is a very serious . . .

DONAHUE: You said you admired him. Do you?

TAYLOR: . . . scholarly book.

DONAHUE: All right. All right.

TAYLOR: “Race, Evolution and Behavior.”

DONAHUE: This young woman . . .

TAYLOR: I recommend it to all of you.

DONAHUE: This young woman wants to ask?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I would first like to say, I am a proud American, an educated black woman and very strong and not fearful of anything, OK?

(APPLAUSE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And I would, one, like to say, that it is shameful that you’re an American. You need to apologize to everyone in this room that’s ethnically diverse. I come from a long line of ancestors that are American and immigrants that built this country and allowed you to go to schools like Yale, allowed your ancestors to have education. You are—it is shameful that you represent a man. All the men in this room should be ashamed of you.
All the Americans in this room should be ashamed of you. And it is shameful that you’re in the proud city of New York.

DONAHUE: You have one minute to respond to the young woman’s comment.

TAYLOR: That sounds . . .

DONAHUE: And let’s also celebrate . . .

TAYLOR: That sounds like . . .

DONAHUE: . . . America, where we don’t shush people. Let them stand up and speak. We got to know where they are. Go ahead.

TAYLOR: That sounds like collective guilt to me. I don’t believe in collective guilt, thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Guilt for what?

TAYLOR: Well, you said every man should be ashamed because I’m a man? For heaven’s sake. Every person with two eyes should be ashamed because I’ve got two eyes?

DONAHUE: David from Washington . . .

TAYLOR: Nonsense.

DONAHUE: . . . you wanted to say briefly? I’m running out of time.

CALLER: Mr. Taylor, I have one wish for you. If you have children, I hope that they bring home someone from another race and marry them.

(LAUGHTER)

CALLER: Shame on you.

(APPLAUSE)

DONAHUE: And we’re looking for you in the front row of that service. We’re looking for you in the front row.

TAYLOR: Phil—Phil—it’s interesting. Back when the whole Civil Rights issue was being debated . . .

DONAHUE: I’m going to give you a chance to make the comment you’re about to share with us . . .

TAYLOR: All right.

DONAHUE: . . . in an uninterrupted fashion.

TAYLOR: Thank you.

DONAHUE: And to do that, I have to interrupt you myself.

We are with Jared Taylor, who’s the editor of “American Renaissance” publication. And we’ll be back in just a moment.

ANNOUNCER: Wednesday, comedian and HBO talk show host Dennis Miller brings his scathing perspective and razor-sharp wit to DONAHUE. That’s funnyman Dennis Miller Wednesday, one on one with Donahue.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DONAHUE: We’re back with Jared Taylor. I promised you 30. I have 30 seconds.

TAYLOR: Yes. I believe the caller was hoping that I would have mixed-race grandchildren. You know, it’s interesting the way more and more even people who style themselves conservatives say that the only solution to the race problem in America is widespread miscegenation. And when we’re all this hippy-happy cafe au lait society, then finally racism will go away. That is an admission, Mr. Donahue, that so long there is a mixed-race society, you will have friction and you will have tension.

Furthermore, it is a death sentence for whites because if miscegenation happens in a widespread way in the United States or Europe, that is no threat to black populations, Asian populations, but it is to whites. Whites will disappear.

DONAHUE: This is Jared Taylor.